Indoor Zaaboot has gone to pot 2022 auto spree

[Zaaboot]

Absolute smasher m8.. you're a true hydro master.. look at those colas beautiful stuff.

Could I pick your massive hydro brain a bit? Lol

Did I see u had EC as high as 2.2 for these girls?? I've just started tootling about with EC this grow.. more for experimentation as an all time lazy, measure nothing soil grower.. I've got my eyes opened already as to how much the plants can take and how much I was most likely underfeeding them before.

I used to just go 'mls per litre' and would have been at 1ml per L now on day 21.. measuring EC this time I'm at 5.5ml in 3L.. so almost 2ml per L and not a burnt tip in sight. Surely this is a good thing and I keep on pushing EC slowly but surely?? Is that the idea if you want to use EC measurements to maximise your crop??

I also read a lot of stuff saying don't go beyond 1.8EC with autos yet you're way over that.. is hydro different that way or can they just take more than the mythical 1.8EC cut off??

Another popular one is 'EC doesn't matter in soil' but surely if you actually want to know how much 'feed' your plants are getting and want to push then as hard as u can feed wise then on the contrary.. its all important regardless of your medium??

Smoke on some of that month cured Predator and think about that lot lol

Any advice or comments always greatly appreciated m8

Hello mate - I have been watching you with the grodans, looking good!

So E.C is a question and a half as everyone has their opinion - as you say, some say dont go over X or never go below Y, personally I think it is nonsense there is nothing set just some very sensible guidelines - the marker for too much or too little in my opinion is plant based - some can take more others are more sensitive.
The way I look at it is the plants will do the talking, once you go too high they will tell you. The beauty is it can be dialled back in minutes and flushed through.

For starters with seedlings, I will always start low circa .6 or .8 depending on the water - the stuff in our water is a mystery, but it does take the EC to a start point, whereas with RO you are starting with 0-ish. Once they fully take I start to push the EC up .1 or .2 at a time, I do this as quickly as I can to get them to their 'happy place' in veg as quickly as possible - for me this ranges from 1.4 to 2 EC depending on plant and this is with the RO:tap mix. they tend to stay there circa the 2 to 2.2 through to the end (some plants just cannot take it this high but most have been fine).
For example today, due to additional evaporation my E.C is bobbing between 2.4 and 2.6 on the truncheon and I will leave it, if later they look unhappy I can reduce it with some PH'd water.
PH plays as big a part as EC as it essentially dictates what the plant will consume - I found keeping it flat throughout at 5.8 gave me minor deficiencies, over time I have found that a floating PH starting at 5.8 and allowing it to float up and down up to 6.2 works best for me and I dont have to add any amendments or supplemental nutrients.

The easy way to look at it is: if the EC of your water is .4 and you take it to 1.8, you have only added 1.4 of nutrients to the mix with the .4 being made up of things like chlorine et al...the plant can take what it can take and will generally only drink what it needs, look at DWC the roots live in the res and they dont drown and the plants dont over feed themselves just because the food is available.

Back to your ladies, as you are testing go for gold, you will be surprised at what they can eat and the difference it makes in the end - too much they will stop eating, but you will always have time to adjust it down. Just keep nudging up, the first signs of fade/burn on the tips is your first sign to dial it back. The only thing is if the res gets lots of different nutes and does not get changed or is recirc you can end up with a nutrient mix made up of god knows what. Less is always more for sure - a good base A&B grow and bloom, a decent PK and some calmag is ample and you know what is in your res at all times then no matter how much tinkering you do.

A very waffley answer, but the gist is really keep pushing until the ladies tell you to sling your hook

 

[hope2grow]

Hello mate - I have been watching you with the grodans, looking good!

So E.C is a question and a half as everyone has their opinion - as you say, some say dont go over X or never go below Y, personally I think it is nonsense there is nothing set just some very sensible guidelines - the marker for too much or too little in my opinion is plant based - some can take more others are more sensitive.
The way I look at it is the plants will do the talking, once you go too high they will tell you. The beauty is it can be dialled back in minutes and flushed through.

For starters with seedlings, I will always start low circa .6 or .8 depending on the water - the stuff in our water is a mystery, but it does take the EC to a start point, whereas with RO you are starting with 0-ish. Once they fully take I start to push the EC up .1 or .2 at a time, I do this as quickly as I can to get them to their 'happy place' in veg as quickly as possible - for me this ranges from 1.4 to 2 EC depending on plant and this is with the RO:tap mix. they tend to stay there circa the 2 to 2.2 through to the end (some plants just cannot take it this high but most have been fine).
For example today, due to additional evaporation my E.C is bobbing between 2.4 and 2.6 on the truncheon and I will leave it, if later they look unhappy I can reduce it with some PH'd water.
PH plays as big a part as EC as it essentially dictates what the plant will consume - I found keeping it flat throughout at 5.8 gave me minor deficiencies, over time I have found that a floating PH starting at 5.8 and allowing it to float up and down up to 6.2 works best for me and I dont have to add any amendments or supplemental nutrients.

The easy way to look at it is: if the EC of your water is .4 and you take it to 1.8, you have only added 1.4 of nutrients to the mix with the .4 being made up of things like chlorine et al...the plant can take what it can take and will generally only drink what it needs, look at DWC the roots live in the res and they dont drown and the plants dont over feed themselves just because the food is available.

Back to your ladies, as you are testing go for gold, you will be surprised at what they can eat and the difference it makes in the end - too much they will stop eating, but you will always have time to adjust it down. Just keep nudging up, the first signs of fade/burn on the tips is your first sign to dial it back. The only thing is if the res gets lots of different nutes and does not get changed or is recirc you can end up with a nutrient mix made up of god knows what. Less is always more for sure - a good base A&B grow and bloom, a decent PK and some calmag is ample and you know what is in your res at all times then no matter how much tinkering you do.

A very waffley answer, but the gist is really keep pushing until the ladies tell you to sling your hook

Much appreciated m8. Thanks

 

[hope2grow]

So my 16 soil girls atm m8 are 21 days old.. EC of their last feed, yesterday/today was 1.4.. all looking strong healthy and green.. would you push EC up next feed or look at sticking at around 1.4 for a few days/week.. maybe a few feeds??.. or is the answer depends how hard you wanna push them??

Hadn't considered your point about subtracting tap water EC from the final number btw.. my tap waters about 0.3 from memory.. even still.. these girls are still getting almost twice my regular nute dosage for this stage of life and seeming loving it.

This sciency shits starting to interest me haha it only took a decade

 

[DCLXVI]

Now @Zaaboot 's plants look fantastic so can't discount what he is saying but! I thought you were supposed to add your nutes +water EC. If the water is 0.4 and you add 1.0EC nutrients then it's 1.4 total.

I think it would make a huge difference in how high your water is and what is in it. Mine is 0.4-0.5EC but is almost 150ppm of calcium carbonate and nearly 8.0pH. Could not get balanced nutrients using it and had to go with RO water system.

Your 0.4 and my 0.4 are probably totally different mineral makeup. But, like Mr.Boot' said, the plant will tell you. Mine certainly said "Old man, we cannot grow under these conditions. We are dying, good day sir!"

 

[Zaaboot]

So my 16 soil girls atm m8 are 21 days old.. EC of their last feed, yesterday/today was 1.4.. all looking strong healthy and green.. would you push EC up next feed or look at sticking at around 1.4 for a few days/week.. maybe a few feeds??.. or is the answer depends how hard you wanna push them??

Hadn't considered your point about subtracting tap water EC from the final number btw.. my tap waters about 0.3 from memory.. even still.. these girls are still getting almost twice my regular nute dosage for this stage of life and seeming loving it.

This sciency shits starting to interest me haha it only took a decade

Hope, I personally would not listen to a word I say about soil, I am sure you saw the shambles that took place here.
I think with soil you would have to be a lot more careful, it won't wash away as quickly.
At this stage/age in your grodan cubes I would wholeheartedly push it up until you find the sweet spot - once you find it in the cubes it becomes pretty much autopilot.

The tap water extraction bit is more to point out that when you hear the maximum or minimum to give your plants you must take it a a guide (from a viable source of course) as if the water is .6 at tap, compared with someone with decent tap at .3 for example, their limit of 2 E.C would be similar to the other grow with the less conductive water running at 1.7ish.

 

[Zaaboot]

Now @Zaaboot I thought you were supposed to add your nutes +water EC.

Your 0.4 and my 0.4 are probably totally different mineral makeup. But, like Mr.Boot' said, the plant will tell you. Mine certainly said "Old man, we cannot grow under these conditions. We are dying, good day sir!"

If tap water is involved I tend to use a 100ltr res to mix up which has an air stone and a water agitator running at all times. fill with water, then add nutes, the next day I PH it.

You are probably right there, I am sure the core 'cleaning agents' in our waters are the same basic ingredients, but where the water sits, teh filters, the pipes it comes through etc...will surely make a difference to what's in it.

 

[hope2grow]

I think with soil you would have to be a lot more careful, it won't wash away as quickly.

Another good point well made

Yes m8 I know hydros your gig but good hydro guys know their science and numbers so really just generally I was asking

I'd always included tap EC in my figure.. was just something that I never thought about prior to you saying.

Thanks again for your help and for takin the time to reply bro u should never stop learning in this game I think.

I've started another Grodan seedling lol I'll have to hang it from the tent ceiling

 

[Zaaboot]

Another good point well made

Yes m8 I know hydros your gig but good hydro guys know their science and numbers so really just generally I was asking

I'd always included tap EC in my figure.. was just something that I never thought about prior to you saying.

Thanks again for your help and for takin the time to reply bro u should never stop learning in this game I think.

I've started another Grodan seedling lol I'll have to hang it from the tent ceiling

Hey Hope - I just looked through a very old diary of mine where I was in cubes only - it’s funny, many years later it’s still roughly the same - start at .6/.8 and work it up to 2/2.2.
And just to follow up from yesterdays high EC - it was a touch hot, added 19.8 mixed water with only PH down and Calmag and bought it down to 2.2 which seems to be the Acapulcos limit, the Sawney and Pink Runtz can take a touch more but at this late stage it is no drama.

 

[hope2grow]

Thanks again m8.. I found some stuff online by a guy called cap'n lol so his styles named cap'n style.. you may have seen it.. he uses grodan cubes.. but his style is to take a photoperiod plant and veg it for donkeys top train spread out.. pull 20oz type thing.. in 20 weeks or so mind u.. anyway.. the really interesting thing about his style was how he was using the cubes.. basically keep as little media/cubage around the roots as possible so the dry out quicker and you can therefore fertigate more often from early on type thing rather than stick a little root system in a huge pot of sarurated cubes and let them dry out for 3/4 days before next fertigation.. how he does it is to pot up 7 times lol it seems the perfect way to use these wee cubes.. but I just can't see an auto taking anywhere near that many repots.. I've seen a few journal's where ppl have used the style but maybe potted up just 3/4 times but even that's gonna be more than an auto would want.. I mean you'd be in flower by the time you got to pot number 3/4.. but his theory of course makes perfect sense.. anyway.. just a few more ramblings on grodan.. Google that 'grodan cubes cap'n style' next time u sit down for a spliff.. worth a read.

 

[Zaaboot]

Thanks again m8.. I found some stuff online by a guy called cap'n lol so his styles named cap'n style.. you may have seen it.. he uses grodan cubes.. but his style is to take a photoperiod plant and veg it for donkeys top train spread out.. pull 20oz type thing.. in 20 weeks or so mind u.. anyway.. the really interesting thing about his style was how he was using the cubes.. basically keep as little media/cubage around the roots as possible so the dry out quicker and you can therefore fertigate more often from early on type thing rather than stick a little root system in a huge pot of sarurated cubes and let them dry out for 3/4 days before next fertigation.. how he does it is to pot up 7 times lol it seems the perfect way to use these wee cubes.. but I just can't see an auto taking anywhere near that many repots.. I've seen a few journal's where ppl have used the style but maybe potted up just 3/4 times but even that's gonna be more than an auto would want.. I mean you'd be in flower by the time you got to pot number 3/4.. but his theory of course makes perfect sense.. anyway.. just a few more ramblings on grodan.. Google that 'grodan cubes cap'n style' next time u sit down for a spliff.. worth a read.

Nice one Hope, I will have a look after perusing AFN with my afternoon tea and doob.
The cubes are so so flexible, I ran the grodan blocks for a decent stint especially running small plants in high numbers, it was when I started Scrogging that I changed from the 4' cubes to the wilma, my objectives then was yield and that was the best way I found to maximise one or two plants in a small space.

Potting up that frequently with Autos scares me a bit - I have done it a couple of times both times shoddily, it didn't seem worth it to me - Photos do give a lot more flexibility in that sense, and it took a lot of convincing for me to pick up an auto due to that reason as I do like a beast of a plant. Credit where it is due - they are now of such exceptional quality that the lack of flexibility has become an irrelevance

Tomatoes in Grodans - is that another Roy Castle trumpet I hear