Organic Forum Discussion

[A4]

Yes and no, it can be water only. It doesn't necessarily have to be one or the other. In true living organics you are doing your best to develop the soil to a point that it works in symbiosis with the plant. That doesn't mean once you have your base mix with nutrients you are done, although it can. Most growers are going to continue to feed the soil throughout the growth cycle of the plant to help obtain the best results. That can be through teas, through added amendments like bone meal, through enzyme teas like sprouting barley or corn and blending it with water. There are as many ways to grow as there are growers.

Choose your path or create you own and learn from it. There are more ways than one to skin a cat.

 

[kushleaf]

Sorry guys i would like to discontinue my time here on AFN this is supposed to be happy place for MJ growets i thought it would be nice here and it was but im not been part of a community that lads eat the face off you for no apparent reason i would like to thank the guys that did help me and others keep up the good work
Please can a mod put my account forward for deletion theres no option here for it

 

[AndyBotwin]

Sorry guys i would like to discontinue my time here on AFN this is supposed to be happy place for MJ growets i thought it would be nice here and it was but im not been part of a community that lads eat the face off you for no apparent reason i would like to thank the guys that did help me and others keep up the good work
Please can a mod put my account forward for deletion theres no option here for it

Nobody ate your face off. And Eek just apologized to you for any misunderstanding. If you think that was rough treatment, you are going to have a very hard time at any canna site. I suggest you take a bit of time off and cool down before leaving for good. This is an amazing site with loads of helpful people, as evidenced by this thread where you are getting lots of good info.

 

[namvet25]

If you have limited access to grow stores you can get all that stuff on the net but buy the time you pay for shipping it's going to cost a small fortune.Isn't there someware you can get promix or sunshine mix near you. Mychorrizae works verywell and a lot of growers here use it.You can get it in powder form and add it to your mix.Justgoogle it and you will get a full explanation what it's used for.

 

[Darth Vapour]

My link wasn't working when I tested it but it's a sticky in the indoor section " FDs guide to growing hefty autos"

 

[kushleaf]

Nobody ate your face off. And Eek just apologized to you for any misunderstanding. If you think that was rough treatment, you are going to have a very hard time at any canna site. I suggest you take a bit of time off and cool down before leaving for good. This is an amazing site with loads of helpful people, as evidenced by this thread where you are getting lots of good info.

I know not need to get hot i dont want to seem as if im having to force secretive information out of people im new and researching and havent a clue as to fixing problems or soil mixs or nutrients yet but when i learn i will gladly pass on my info or ideas or general help I have only just got around ph nutes lighting etc this is more technical waters im surfing now and sure to hit a few waves along the way

 

[AndyBotwin]

I know not need to get hot i dont want to seem as if im having to force secretive information out of people im new and researching and havent a clue as to fixing problems or soil mixs or nutrients yet but when i learn i will gladly pass on my info or ideas or general help I have only just got around ph nutes lighting etc this is more technical waters im surfing now and sure to hit a few waves along the way

No worries mate. Unfortunately it isn't so simple because like A4 said, there are so many ways of organic growing that there isn't one universal set of guidelines. Though there are some folks out there for whom TLO is almost a religion and they go nuts if you dare to deviate from what they consider to be the 'true' way. But most of us are continually trying new things in hopes of improving our results and methods, so I'd say go with something that makes sense to you right now. If you can't get all the supplies you need to create a soil recipe, modify it to what is available in your area. Lots of good folks here who could help you do that, but it may take some time. Ultimately with some trial and error you will settle on what works best for you, and that might be very different than what works best for me.

I personally never got my soil mixes to the point where I could grow cannabis crops the way I wanted with water only. I do that very successfully with my veggies, but the cannabis always needed more. I'm sure that's due to lack of skill on my part, but I'm OK with that so I supplement with teas and organic nutrients. I also use myco in powered form (Great White brand) like namvet mentioned and I am happy with the results. I see it as one of those things that it can't hurt to add it, so why not?

 

[pop22]

kushleaf, below is my soil recipe. There is entirely too much information to go into trying to explain how and why everything works. Compost alone will not get you where you want to be. It takes diversity of ingredients, especially in nutritional amendments but also in your base mix. You need different bases with different textures in order to break the base up and make it more loamy. You also need a certain amount of clay added for cation exchange which is what will hold your nutrients in suspension once the beneficial bacteria have processes them. There is no "most important" factor in creating a soil, every aspect is very important to get right but at the end of the day you want your nutrients in the soil at a correct ratio, this is where testing comes in to play. I have sent my soil to lab testing facilities in order to ensure that the correct NPK ratios are attained as well as Ca to Mg, zinc, boron, etc. Logan Labs is the company I use but there are several out there.

I suggest starting off with a proven base and building from that with what you have locally. Once you think it is close, send it off to a lab and have it tested. It is cheap insurance, Logan charges me $30 to test. It will give you an idea of what else you need to add to your soil to have the perfect mix.


8 gallons Premier Sphagnum Peat Moss - $7.11
2 gallons Vermaplex Black Castings - $2.50
2 gallons Permagreen Garden Soil - $2.36
4 gallons Sunshine Perlite - $3.46
2 gallons Sunshine Vermiculite - $1.60
4 gallons GH CocoTek - $5.00
2 gallons Black Kow Mushroom Compost - $1.00
2 gallons Black Kow Manure Compost - $1.25
1 gallon -1 cup Calcium Bentonite - $12.00
1 cup Sodium Bentonite - $.80


For the buffer I mixed up this and added 1 1/2 cups to the entire mix:


1 1/2 cups Garden Lime - $.15
1 1/2 cups Gypsum - $.19
3 cups Powdered Oyster Shell - $3.60


Add to the mix for nutrients:


4 cups Crab Shell Meal - $3.33
8 cups Kelp Meal - $4.00
8 cups Fish Meal - $2.40
8 cups Bone Meal - $1.60
1 cup Langbeinite - $.69
4 cups Neem Seed Meal - $2.83
2 cups Alfalfa - $.48
1 cup Soft Rock Phosphate - $.63
1 cup Azomite - $1.00


Total Costs for ~ 30 Gallons of soil = $57.98


$1.93 per gallon of soil with all nutrients

Ok and where can you buy this stuff that cheap?? For me, that will certainly not be locally. A 2 quart bag of perlite runs $7.95. What is "black castings"? Worm castings? if so, tha'ts around $7 a lb! Even online all shipped at once, the best price I can find will cost me 3 to 4 times what you quote. If it wasn't for this, I'd be more inclined to do this!

 

[kushleaf]

No worries mate. Unfortunately it isn't so simple because like A4 said, there are so many ways of organic growing that there isn't one universal set of guidelines. Though there are some folks out there for whom TLO is almost a religion and they go nuts if you dare to deviate from what they consider to be the 'true' way. But most of us are continually trying new things in hopes of improving our results and methods, so I'd say go with something that makes sense to you right now. If you can't get all the supplies you need to create a soil recipe, modify it to what is available in your area. Lots of good folks here who could help you do that, but it may take some time. Ultimately with some trial and error you will settle on what works best for you, and that might be very different than what works best for me.

I personally never got my soil mixes to the point where I could grow cannabis crops the way I wanted with water only. I do that very successfully with my veggies, but the cannabis always needed more. I'm sure that's due to lack of skill on my part, but I'm OK with that so I supplement with teas and organic nutrients. I also use myco in powered form (Great White brand) like namvet mentioned and I am happy with the results. I see it as one of those things that it can't hurt to add it, so why not?

They way i mean to say if is i can get organic soil garden lime perlite locally say that will be my base the rest i will have to order this will be nutritional elements i dont think i will need 5 different types of bat guano thats just a waste so to bring me back to original post to fill my N needs will ineed bat guano and bloodmeal and bonemeal or will only one do the job same for P K and micros
I know its kinda like someguy explained that its a range of foods put there for the plant to use as it likes at the time
But this is why im asking if i have 5 different N sources thats plenty of choice but isnt this to much N
I think what im trying to say is ratios portions contents
I know its to feed the soil not the plant the plant will feed off the soil this is why i brought up micprrhizae because its supposed to live feed shit and then breakdown into available nutrients for the plant to take up which is kinda like tlo i have read dirts revs alot of guides
But in uk my soil bags are 40L standard and im only loking to grow 3-4 plants at a time and would like to go tlo
Would likw to know howuch product of 12 nutritional elements to buy for eavh element category

 

[namvet25]

What are you referring to by 12 elements?