New Grower Auoflowring GMO

[Mr Piggy]

With all due respect it feels a little like a couple of you are implying that any concerns against GM products are a misunderstanding or disagreement with science. I take exception(though not offense by any stretch) to that on the grounds that I and probably a couple others here have a pretty solid foundation in science. Science isn't a consensus of what we know it's an ever-evolving process of discovery, as well as a methodology for said discovery. Without an abundance of data we can't make assumptions about the efficacy or safety of research, and yet that is what people selling GM fruits and vegetables spliced with animal or bacterial genes are expecting the world to do. Science doesn't accept things as fact, there are no facts in science only best guesses based on available data. The scariest thing about the science of GM products is that the bulk of it is funded by corporate interests. To give you all an analogy, what happens when the national institute of drug abuse(NIDA) sponsors research into the "dangers" of cannabis? They usually get exactly the results they were looking for...

Absolutely, there are no facts, just best ideas at the time. As someone who is in the field you should also understand that a lack of evidence is not an argument. Not having information about GMOs being harmful is not evidence for harm in and of itself. If you can show me published and reviewed studies that show GMO foods harming people I am more than willing to read them and take it in, that's how it works.

I also don't trust a lot of the studies put out by corporations trying to cover their ass, but not everyone is out to get everyone else. You have to consider the fact that many of these studies can be reviewed and may have been done correctly. This is the same argument I have with people about vaccinations, sure a lot of the studies are funded by pharma, but they are correct none the less.

My point is, if you make a claim that GMOs are harmful, you must provide me with solid evidence of your claim. Until then it's just speculation and doesn't hold water. No offense meant to anyone, that's just the way it is.

 

[Cricket]

Firstly, I consider it a great honor to be with you all. I've been an on and off lurker for a long time now. Wonderful place, wonderful people, incredible information.

Secondly, I'm half drunk and completely tired. I read a little and know I can't make it all the way through tonight, but I have to comment nevertheless. I hope to not be stepping on toes or beating dead horses.

I read an article a while back where monsanto was trying to set up shop around Pueblo, CO to begin their abominations. Can't find the article now. I believe there has already been GM testing on Cannabis for some time now. I believe when we go fixing what isn't broken, pandora's box will be forever undone. I believe that when we alter something so sacred, the tamper proof seal is broken or missing, and there can be no undoing it, minus perhaps by the original manufacturer.

Like GMO Salmon, for example. How could we remove this altered DNA from the pool? I believe that when we bumble our fingers all over something we so thinly pretend to understand, the only foreseeable conclusion is a magnitude of disaster that we can not yet comprehend. What if there was a type of ELS code in the genetic make up of all living things? What if this was entwined with the aura? Are we in effect creating a doppelganger by destroying this? What if when we eat GMO BS our bodies rightly judge it to be an enemy threat and attack it, loosing energy instead of gaining it? What if?

 

[Corgy]

Welcome aboard Cricket

All very good valid points..... If that were to come to pass, "nature" will yet again have dealt an challenging hand, to the collection of atoms and molecules that any system is made of, such as humans and box jelly fish..... Mind, I don't think the little particle buggers will care one way or the other.

I think the gist of your train of thought is preservation which is a nice thing for humans, but preservation is universally "un-natural", except in the sense that the basic building particles is thought to last virtually forever, or at least a very long time indeed, electrons, neutrons, bosoms, photons, quarks and such, they are in good shape when it comes to preservation, and can amuse themselves by creating ever changing temporary systems until the end of time.....

If there is indeed ELS(Equidistant Letter Sequences I believe....?) in DNA, then "nature" made it so, and may be working on changing it, according to the ironclad universal law of change..... Me thinks!

A doppelganger, that's an interesting thought, as long as I'm the boss... Vacuum the house, the backyard needs a little attention and the canna needs a watering.... Would work for me!

 

[Mr Piggy]

Even if the salmon farmed on the west coast escaped, they would not introduce themselves into the current salmon gene pool. They are Atlantic salmon, which belong in the genus Salmo. Pacific salmon are their own genus called Oncorhynchus. This means there will be no interbreeding. The real travesty of fish farms has nothing to do with GMO, it's that a bunch of fish with a large natural range are packed into a small area that allows for fecal matter to build up like crazy, and for fish lice to infect them all.

It's very important to be careful when talking about science and using phrases like "I feel" or "I believe." Make sure to back up your statement with verifiable proof, or at least good evidence. Otherwise it's just speculation.

 

[MisterHarpy]

http://bcseeds.com/indoor-forever-buds-p-159.html hmmmmm what are your guys opinion on this, not that im buying or anything just that since its a cool thread i would love to see your guys opinion on this since its already being produced.

 

[gbd]

Apparently it's fake. I posted about it a few months back and found out they're just a scam company.

 

[MisterHarpy]

Oh wow ok I was so intrigued by it, and noe that I look at it and created an account its $200,000 lmao

 

[ThatKracker]

http://bcseeds.com/indoor-forever-buds-p-159.html hmmmmm what are your guys opinion on this, not that im buying or anything just that since its a cool thread i would love to see your guys opinion on this since its already being produced.

Pretty damn cool, I'd like to get one just to see it in action

 

[medi]

Absolutely, there are no facts, just best ideas at the time. As someone who is in the field you should also understand that a lack of evidence is not an argument. Not having information about GMOs being harmful is not evidence for harm in and of itself. If you can show me published and reviewed studies that show GMO foods harming people I am more than willing to read them and take it in, that's how it works.


I also don't trust a lot of the studies put out by corporations trying to cover their ass, but not everyone is out to get everyone else. You have to consider the fact that many of these studies can be reviewed and may have been done correctly. This is the same argument I have with people about vaccinations, sure a lot of the studies are funded by pharma, but they are correct none the less.


My point is, if you make a claim that GMOs are harmful, you must provide me with solid evidence of your claim. Until then it's just speculation and doesn't hold water. No offense meant to anyone, that's just the way it is.

My only claim is that there is as yet no scientific consensus that the products are safe, this was restated by 300 scientists on 1 Feb at ENSSER and one of the signatories, Nicolas Defarge, had this to say:


”Progress in science occurs through controversial debate involving scientific arguments. Our statement, peer-reviewed and published in the open access literature, is now one of them. The debate about the health effects of the long-term consumption of GMOs and of the residues of pesticides they contain is ongoing. It can only be solved by further studies using accurate protocols enabling the investigation of long-term effects. These must be published in open access journals with the raw data being made available and not kept secret. We should bear in mind that the studies performed by industry to support the release of GMOs on the market are usually not peer-reviewed at the time the GMO is commercialized.”(1)


The science is ongoing, and as it happens there are an equal number of scientists trying to find health risks as there are trying to disprove it. And it's worth noting that a statistically substantial number of the studies trying to disprove any health risks are funded by biotechnology. (2)


I think it's really important that we as an international community wholeheartedly endorse responsible science to take place, but use extreme caution in allowing these products to come to market in the interim. You might be surprised to find that the FDA has done absolutely no formal testing on genetically engineered foods and has still stated they are "substantially equivalent". (3)

Anyway, that I think is all I have to contribute since my views aren't going to change without substantial science coming in. I do think it's an important international conversation to have, and I hope that we look to our scientists for the answers while respecting that even after the science comes in there might be many people who would be more comfortable with reasonable labeling because at the end of the day freedom of choice is what makes being human worth it.

 

[Gonzo]

Hello everybody. Very interesting discussion so far.

Genetics is science far beyond corporations or Monsanto. Humankind has developed science to the level, where deeper understanding of living creatures building blocks and behaviours is possible. And that is going on. Not only plants genetics, also human genetics will be studied more and more and people will start to modify not only plants but humans. Before year 2100, very, very serious impacts on human genes will be performed, voluntarily of course. It will most probably start with ageeing slowdown and deseases prevention, where connection between certain gene and disease would be discovered.

Within couple of decades, genetic doctors will offer first medical services including genetic modifications to the public. And people will start to use it more and more.

Like always, humankind will make some mistakes, but not fatal and Sun will remain the biggest genetics modificator for some time. Humankind would not exist without billions and billions accidental genetical modifications made by sun in past millions of years. These little occasional changes and natural selection has developed human brain so far, that we can understand genetics and develop it further.

Some people might be afraid of further development and outcomes, but they will not slow down these processes for a single second.