Why not breed with F1's?

[Bromeo]

Thanks for the replies guys and very zin thought there mustard. Breed f1s don't breed f1s....noodle don't noodle...(Kung Foo panda). I guess it just comes down to being choosy regardless of anything. A shit f3 is not better then a awesome f1. And how would a hobby grower not need to use femmed beans? Not many regulars out there. As I understand it most femmd seeds from commerical growers are from reversed plants not unhealthy herms.

 

[yodabuds]

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A female plant reversed right is not a hermie nor will it create off spring more proned to hermi unless genetics wise its already predisposed.... First act of breeding is to take a very abused plant and see of it survives and does not hermi on you, as bad traits are not what you want to pass down.... I personally think f1's should not be released as to whose benefit is an f1's? The phenos you'll have from th f2's will be so varied in my uneducated opinion breeding a cross to f1 is just a jumping point. For instance you see a cross you like that's an f1 hybrid... Why not if available by each strain that makes that cross up and make it yourself? You than not only have the cross beans, you will also have beans from each parent..l I myself would rather play with three strains, than 1 if "breeding"
To breed to painstaking efforts with the males and not making a mess crossing everything... I love fem pollen tossing... As the beans are for myself only and I could honestly care less what they comprise of, other than they are Fems and will produce me good medicine...l the only crosses or "breeding" I was playing with was with just four crosses, from the four only one have I taken the time to make into f2's as I did find a very stable cross (majority of phenos are all alike ) that is a cross I would want to continue..l the rest... Right now, once you get past f1 the "easiest part" that's when the note taking and the real work begins! And I mean an overwhelming amount of work....
I will one day be proud of my cross I'm working on.. But it's only the VERY VERY early stages, I have plans of making the cross, back crossing it to a photo of its lineage than work it back out...
So in the mean time read up on learning to reverse as than if your a med user as myself any beans that are results of you fucking around will always have a grander purpose of serving you meds shit part of the fun is to see what comes out....


My main goals with "breeding" right now, are just to make exact replicas of strains I spent hard earned money on... If any accidental crossing takes place than those beans are just bonuses.... I have a hard time spending $125 for a pack of seeds and not to make more.... I don't want to loose that genetic... There so many good strains that lately I don't even feel the need to "breed"l I feel more the need to make insurance policies that I don't ever loose a supply of what I paid for....
I mean with the likes of Og raskal gear, some of the Cali connect Gear and my Tom Hill collection... First order of business (thinking this is a year plus project) is to make fem seeds of each strain... Who wouldn't want fem beans of some of these gems?
So my advice, into start to READ REAF, find some bag seed or seeds you got plenty of and start playing with Collidal Silver (recommended safety wise) or STS (what I prefer, but straight up toxic shit ya don't want on your skin or to breath) get down the reversal process than begin the "breeding" game....
Enough of the dragon ramble... Main point I'm trying to make is don't get discouraged, don't give up, follow your breeding dreams... When making a cross, be sure to run your ideas first to the original breeder (it's a respect thing) also DO NOT of making replicas of your seeds you paid for, recreate than give/sell those as it directly affects breeders bottom line... And that's not cool... (we all make noob mistakes ;( ) most important have FUN!!!! If you need any help give me a holler...I know very little admitly, but do love brainstorming with others... They are some great talents at work here.... Definitely go check out Evols Breeding project a GREAT READ, sorta gives you an idea what's involved etc.... It's no easy undertaken....

Ultimately look to yourself and find the real reason you want to do what your doing... If the intentions are good go with it... If not so good (all a personal opinion.... As in my heart to sell seeds or make money from my projects is not my intent... My main intent is to keep myself medicated and to help others, in my opinion both Nobel ideas....) that think twice about what your getting yourself into... Be warned, crossing and playing with genetics can become an ADDICTION....

MODS: can we get a under the influence of a dragon emoticon (sp?) to give people a fair warning post that's being
Posted is more than likely a rambling mess... LMAO LOVE ME Dragons! I can not and should not be held accountable for my action while I'm in flight.... :nightdrag:

Edit: don't want people getting the wrong idea of an f1 if something catches your eye and you already know your going to love it.. Save your self the trouble... Get the f1 cross, as for me the f1's I got, I did just cause sometimes you have a hunch, gotta go with it..
:cough: fire x c99 smoked pure c99 once and I LOVED HER, cres's c99 that I smoked in his other crosses have all been SUPER POTENT AND DANK! Now take into account the fire part of this cross is EXPENSIVE as hell..... Now at $45 vs $125 that is a F1 cross I WILL shout from the mountain tops about.... HighRise

 

[Torched]

It seems to me that the reason a "breeder" would not want to use an F1 is that it's a total unknown. You can tell what some of the genetic traits are but only the ones that have expressed in that particular plant and only the ones that are easily determinable. What you don't know is anything about what genes the plant carries that are not expressed. Maybe this is the most pristine example of the shittiest genetic pool you can imagine. For a "breeder" it's a shot in the dark to know what you are selecting and what you are getting along for the ride as they are generating 1000's of off spring.

For the pollen chuckers breed everything you can get, fems and all. Your not running a breeding program so if only 70% of your plants end up as potent as the f1 your happy. You'll select up and improve your stock as you go by not replanting seeds from crappy parents. And your result can be good but not as consistent as a breeders plants. But you know crappy weed is just a reason to roll the doobie twice as fat! :smokebuds:

 

[evol]

hybrid vigor from F1's is a big plus imo. That would be the only reason I can see to not breed past F1. But with proper crosses and selection you don't need that boost of vigor from genetic variety.

 

[Bromeo]

My goal is to never need the dealer or the seed distributor anymore. To find something I really like and work tthe shit out of it. To learn and teach. To have fun and never make this into a job or work. Oh and crap weed is great for moochers. They can smoke the crap ones.

 

[skrewg314]

Yodabuds- well said my friend, and thank you for shedding light on a subject I myself can really only speculate about.

 

[yodabuds]

May I make a suggestion... Unless you have multiple rooms, this will take some time...but hard work has great rewards! Buy a pack of reg seeds that catch your eye.. Stagger plant them say 2.5 weeks apart from each other say 3,3,4. Keep them self contained.. You'll end up with so many seeds you'll be well on your way of freeing yourself! Than you will have all these beans you can practice on before using more genetics you paid good money for or want to buy. A surplus of beans will also allow you to explore thing such as hydro etc.....

 

[Bromeo]

Oh yoda why don't you ever scope out my threads. I've got stuff growing all over the place. You should come over to the dark side and check em out. I'll save a seat for you at any of them. I'll even share a :smokebuds: I even have some of my first crosses growing in them.

My single biggest concern about any breeding is the ethics of it all. Once they sell it is it mine? Not for anything but my personal use and to share with others. Not to sell.

 

[yodabuds]

I'm right along with you on that boat.... that's why I threw my hands up in the air and said ya know what, I'm just happy smoking great bud, I could care less what I make, I just want variety and good smoke, that's why I'm moving over to photos, as I can just find a nice pheno I love make a mom and keep her and be done with the seed shit, and just take all said made seeds and grow them along with the moms and clones. :thumbs:

 

[Epic Genetics]

The only reason I say I wouldnt recommend breeding with fems is due to the fack that fems are made from selfing(I could be very wrong on these points) which is essentially a herm plant. Either chemically or stress induced, they to me, introduce an activated hermaphrodite gene into the gene pool you are breding with. Like I said, im nobody special and could be the furthest from the truth I could possibly be. Just my opinion

you are right about one thing ,, couldnt be more wrong , you are living in the past , the distant past at that

proper fems are not hermies in any way whatsoever , and until you learn the facts i would apreciate if you read more and type less , spreading mis-information is highly frowned upon

peace