Could be Leaf Septoria - possible spider mite - N def early suspected

[hecno]

Smokey , Charlie Carp is a 10.1.6 . I use Nutri tech 10.10.10 https://www.nutri-tech.com.au/factsheets/veg-tech-triple-ten.pdf This I use as a base .
Then I play around with the ratios - Lets say I want a .5.5.10 , so I will add 5 ml a liter which gives me a 5.5.5 then add seaweed to get the 5.5.10 I want . I have been doing this a long time now and works well for me . One of the best things you can do is to find something [ nutrient brands ] you like and get to understand it and how it works , What will happen after you have your soil right it ends up costing very little for a grow as in nutrient cost . There are a number of organic products that work well together that we have here , I have never had a bug issue of any kind and I live in the tropics as you know . So me old mate , Start building your soil -- now -- for your next grow and I am more than happy to help you along the way . one other thing I always reuse my soil and may have to top it up a bit with new soil for the next grow . You being a tight Bum will be happy
Ps , I would dish the soil you are growing in now after this grow .

 

[Waira]

:smoking: don't beat yourself up too much Smokey, nothing is totally sideways here! now if you fragged a plant into a smoking hot mess, then we'd be breaking balls a little on ya-

Yup, last season with the KIS Organics amended soil, the 10gal pot vs. larger plant bit my ass proper, they depleted the soil by early bloom and pots were solid roots. Then I had to scramble a bit with synthetic to speed right-now-available PK into them, then shift back to organic nutes to try and finish... because of this, a few pots went wonky with pH, a real SOB to fix too! ...lesson learned, and I have to re-think how to do this and keep the "water only" gig going full cycle, with light organic amending here and there... likely will be staged transplants into fresh soil...
Point is, it's all too easy to get knocked off the pH stability train, then nute availability jumps the damn rails next! Root packed pots breath less well, and the root zone has no open space "buffering" for such pH shifts; cation uptake can load up the H+ levels doing so in a more concentrated way I believe, that's why the crowded pots are such bitches to correct!
.... I think you're getting something similar happening... upside mate, is I see only lowers affected mostly,, that some are getting tapped and dropped is not that bad, fans doing their job... Dunno if it's the lighting, but I think some overall color is coming back... I'm at something of a loss as to why it showing what looks mainly to be N defc... A full reversal of pale color is unlikely too, some defc. can be hard to reverse, if at all... it's possible that what's getting in, like S, is getting used up right away for other needs (like terp's and proteins) so leaves are slow to show improvement... Foliar is a slow but steady corrector, keep hitting them with kelp extract, dash o' epsoms, maybe even a little of inorganic (now-available) N/grow nutes, just a dash to slip into leaves, and offer full coverage nutes to support processing and metabolism...
In regards to N sources, MoG mentioned ammonium = NH4+ vs. ammonia NH3,... as a cation, it brings an H+ (acid) out into the soil while being taken in by the roots... Nitrate is an anion, NO3-, so when that goes in, an OH- goes out (alkaline)... This is all about maintaining a balanced charge load within the plant, and connected directly to this is uptake/release of H+/OH- to maintain internal pH properly.... It's a juggling act aimed to keep things on an even keel basically!

If you pH probe is telling you it's close to or in range pH, then that's more than half the battle right there,.. last you mentioned they were borderline to a bit too acidic. That dodlo', Hec echo's what I mentioned; it's slow, and very uneven in it's correcting capacity because it's not covering the full volume of the pot, just surface down; tight root ball slows this greatly!

 

[smokeyfromau]

Smokey , Charlie Carp is a 10.1.6 . I use Nutri tech 10.10.10 https://www.nutri-tech.com.au/factsheets/veg-tech-triple-ten.pdf This I use as a base .
Then I play around with the ratios - Lets say I want a .5.5.10 , so I will add 5 ml a liter which gives me a 5.5.5 then add seaweed to get the 5.5.10 I want . I have been doing this a long time now and works well for me . One of the best things you can do is to find something [ nutrient brands ] you like and get to understand it and how it works , What will happen after you have your soil right it ends up costing very little for a grow as in nutrient cost . There are a number of organic products that work well together that we have here , I have never had a bug issue of any kind and I live in the tropics as you know . So me old mate , Start building your soil -- now -- for your next grow and I am more than happy to help you along the way . one other thing I always reuse my soil and may have to top it up a bit with new soil for the next grow . You being a tight Bum will be happy
Ps , I would dish the soil you are growing in now after this grow .

Hey Hecno, thank you mate , sounds like a great idea, the old searles maybe could be too dry to use, not sure its in a wheelie bin, that gets some sun at times- did find a worm in it once i dug damper, and it was damp not dry. It would be about 200L maybe. There is a tonic charlie carp with only 3 N, and the fert with 10N. I wonder if searles kickalong would be good adding to the soil also,has good n p and k values, then there is the active8 pallet from rocky point. NTS i think i can gett Plant Doc to order in. I wil be growing again near the end of april , its great also wont waste the soil as much also, and i used old scap timber on the grasshounds mesh so it could cater for the girls heights. The kelp and neem meal could be used also and rock minerals if needed, should be in the searles still, totally will be getting rid of the waccy soil it can be fill the new home for the girls for the path, sure is slow purchased the bushranger on the 4th jan now in transit, should see tomorrow then up to doing the form work to install the shed girls will be in style instead of a tent that takes time to put up and pull down as it blocks some air coming into the house

:smoking: don't beat yourself up too much Smokey, nothing is totally sideways here! now if you fragged a plant into a smoking hot mess, then we'd be breaking balls a little on ya-

Yup, last season with the KIS Organics amended soil, the 10gal pot vs. larger plant bit my ass proper, they depleted the soil by early bloom and pots were solid roots. Then I had to scramble a bit with synthetic to speed right-now-available PK into them, then shift back to organic nutes to try and finish... because of this, a few pots went wonky with pH, a real SOB to fix too! ...lesson learned, and I have to re-think how to do this and keep the "water only" gig going full cycle, with light organic amending here and there... likely will be staged transplants into fresh soil...
Point is, it's all too easy to get knocked off the pH stability train, then nute availability jumps the damn rails next! Root packed pots breath less well, and the root zone has no open space "buffering" for such pH shifts; cation uptake can load up the H+ levels doing so in a more concentrated way I believe, that's why the crowded pots are such bitches to correct!
.... I think you're getting something similar happening... upside mate, is I see only lowers affected mostly,, that some are getting tapped and dropped is not that bad, fans doing their job... Dunno if it's the lighting, but I think some overall color is coming back... I'm at something of a loss as to why it showing what looks mainly to be N defc... A full reversal of pale color is unlikely too, some defc. can be hard to reverse, if at all... it's possible that what's getting in, like S, is getting used up right away for other needs (like terp's and proteins) so leaves are slow to show improvement... Foliar is a slow but steady corrector, keep hitting them with kelp extract, dash o' epsoms, maybe even a little of inorganic (now-available) N/grow nutes, just a dash to slip into leaves, and offer full coverage nutes to support processing and metabolism...
In regards to N sources, MoG mentioned ammonium = NH4+ vs. ammonia NH3,... as a cation, it brings an H+ (acid) out into the soil while being taken in by the roots... Nitrate is an anion, NO3-, so when that goes in, an OH- goes out (alkaline)... This is all about maintaining a balanced charge load within the plant, and connected directly to this is uptake/release of H+/OH- to maintain internal pH properly.... It's a juggling act aimed to keep things on an even keel basically!

If you pH probe is telling you it's close to or in range pH, then that's more than half the battle right there,.. last you mentioned they were borderline to a bit too acidic. That dodlo', Hec echo's what I mentioned; it's slow, and very uneven in it's correcting capacity because it's not covering the full volume of the pot, just surface down; tight root ball slows this greatly!

Hey Waira mate ! Thanks Yes i have been a bit hard on myself , feeling like what did i do, t. I would hate to see the poor girl in a smoking messy, they eps nimmy look bad enough, some greening maybe not sure, maybe some of those yellow leaves may not come back

I remember that Waira we both had issues with the pots with Liberty SLH Durban and lesser extend Bubba Kush. Maybe even though 50L (45L real volume) pots the girls are 1.8 and 2 meters. It looks like small pot issues again, would not be surprised to see issues with PineApple Poison she is 1.5metres in the 35L pot (real volume 32), she has some yellowing. Maybe i added nutes too soon or i didnt flush enough, i did a few water only watering.

Good idea Waira, mate, i was thinking of hitting the leaves with the powerfed ( inorganic nute), that is what i did first time around i gave them some N, and 5in1 is only 6N and organic so maybe slow to show results. I did a spray on the leaves this afternoon for the girls as i dont wish to water as the base looks damp still, tomorrow should be good up to 30c. I can foliar in mid afternono with the sun is dapple

I remember MOG, saying that the curled leaves was either Nute lockout or a CA issues., more salts in the inorganics and can cause nute lockout more easily than organic. Its not a big probe like yours and Hecnos, I did manage to shove it in the side of Nimmys pot and i got very close to 6 at the time i did the readings.

I got Gogo Juice today ( nice tonic for soil and plants micro nutes in it like boron 1% etc, and if i cant get Searles Fish and Kelp will get Charlie Carp for the girls fish needs

the smaller leaves maybe they got a bit darker, more like Nimmy the boy, who refired down in the graveyard to my horror, but that lovely colour in the smaller leaves is nice to see.

Last watering on the 2nd, i did a nice soaked tea of neem meal, kelp meal, fulvic humic with eps salt? This would not be too much for them Waira or you thing so mate? neem is 4 1 2 and kelp 1 0 2 NPK

Girls as of this afternoon

Nimmy with sunsetting behind the tall trees along the creek and range behind that

still some curling which why i thought lockout again ? poor Nimmmy many of these all over her


Pineapple Poison, i gave her some ep salt, looked like a mg issue or something , could be the dredded small pot cause she is tall

plan for Nimmy and Grin, syn N on the leaves, gogo juice is soil is dry enough, tiny N organic soil? like charlie

complete to date grow diary

 

[Waira]

It's early stage blooming now on them, right? Looking at that last post, lack of P concerns me; it too can yellow and cause necrotic spots...
I think you're past any nute overload mate, if they were that badly locked out, symptoms would be more glaring...
You've decent amount of K and other stuff going in, so it's P that needs boosting mainly.... What's on hand? Bat-poo?

 

[smokeyfromau]

It's early stage blooming now on them, right? Looking at that last post, lack of P concerns me; it too can yellow and cause necrotic spots...
I think you're past any nute overload mate, if they were that badly locked out, symptoms would be more glaring...
You've decent amount of K and other stuff going in, so it's P that needs boosting mainly.... What's on hand? Bat-poo?

hey Waira mate I checked the PH this morning appears Mizz Grin is in the high 5.8-6.2. Nimmy she was around 5.8-6 this time, more leaf curling , at the tips could be a problem with P and K since i held back thinking it was nute lookout, the stuff i have for them in P and K is great, i can synthetic hit them also with PK 13/25, but maybe the organic PK is best, still fast and slow
Its rebagged as Richgro for bunnings
FERTILISER - GUANO GOLD-KWIK START® FEATURES & BENEFITS

• 80% Citrate Soluble P.
• Fast & slow release of Phosphorus.
• 13.6% Total P.
• 32.9% Calcium.
• 23.8% Silica.
• 8.6% Organic Carbon.
• Full range of trace elements.
• High CEC; 129Me/100g.
• Bulk Density, 1.5 MT per m3.
• Granulated (2-5mm) easy to handle & spread through all planters airseeders, combines & stool splitters.

The K is organic from Richgro, not sure if its rebagged from the same place above

• Certified organic
• Fast Acting
• For extra colour in flowers
• For extra taste in fruit and vegies

Analysis:

0N:0P:41K.

From Powerfeed foliar maybe a tad of greening on grin, not 100# sure

 

[smokeyfromau]

Nimmy may be more a worry than Grinner, but i think from memory she did take some time to fill out. What concerns me is the all the brown tips with Nimmy, this morning checked the PH, was wondering if the meter was playing up, but gave different readings for the SSSC girls

Example of readings Miss Grinner - 5.5, 5.4, 4.5,5.2, 5.5,5.6
Example of poor Miss Nimmy - 4.5 4.9 5 i thought the meter was stuffed. ? possible overdose of epson salt

Where as SSSC girls some leave issues, so over the mix, even if i start with organic before going to Hecnos recipe, if need more time.

PE 6.2 6.1 6.2 = good so her def is not from ph? i think i spotted PM so will be using spray later
SMSF 5.5 6.1 6.2 = mm should be okay area, some yellowing
KH 5.8 5.5 6.2 - should be okay yellowing is some defic

I am not sure if thats insecicdale soap but Nimmy and Grinn have makings over the leaves, not really white more slight blue i thought it was PM, maybe could be still

@Waira update above with images below mate, girls are damp the Sat girls so will have to wait for any flush or waterings, had some rain on them, last night they went under so will have to get a fan Grinner is just 2cm from the roof . She is 1.94meters from trunk to top.

Video of Nimmy and Grinner notice the poor leaves

Grinner thicker Nimmy, maybe slight thicker over night

leaves when they go with brown blotches

SSSC girls
could be MN or other issues, KH has been drinking water like a crazy girl, but she has lots of mass

Reason i think MN is the green veins still, some other yellowing also going on, i think next grow will get a supply of fish and kelp, seemed great with Liberty Haze etc

 

[hecno]

Stone the crows mate .

 

[smokeyfromau]

Stone the crows mate .

I know Hecno they are a bit larger than i wanted them to be mate, next time better training, talk about crows i got a new respect for them, this huge eagle was in the area all the birds were chasing it and the noisy miners dropped off first, they cant go high, then little Miss butcher was the last small bird, then 7 crows kept at the eagle and dropped off and the last crow ( assume the alpha male) was last, he was so high up and then he gave up and did a massive sky dive back down i wished i had the camera on hand

 

[smokeyfromau]

Nimmy is full of curling leaf. Some odd reason the ph seemed to be very low last time, concerned the meter was on the way out, but the SSSC girls were all in the high 5s low 6. They got a few leave issues also, this grow is a bit of a disaster this time.

Thinking out aloud here

1. Possible leaf septoria as the other Nimmy from a grow or 2 back had the same problem but maybe less marks, could it be it, same spot they girls are in? - Have copper spray but reluntant to use it, as it could stay on the forming tiny buds/flower
2. Or PH has gone out of wack due to nutirent excess? or some other reason,
3. Would a flush fix this, 2 x volume pot?
4. epsom salt over load? that would be very unlikely

She will not have many leaves if she makes it, she will be not at her best, nor would be the seed if she has any I only got 2 Nimmy seeds left, 1 could be void, as was in a jar without a bag


@hecno mate could not be the eco, and its now a discontinued product, i got the micronoised liquid dolomite from the plant doctor down here, it had to be dusted off, the girl said no one was buying it hence why it will be discontinued also. The girl gave it to me for a discount also

 

[hecno]

Mate , these problems are beyond me . The only thing I can think of is soil Ph due to you trying to fix things has thrown the soil out of balance . With the size pots you are using you have to be dialed in on feeding from the beginning . I would say yes to giving them a big flush to neutralize the soil , then a small feed to help bring balance back to the soil . I am afraid I have very little experience Photos But I can't help but thinking the soil is the issue here .