HLG 260 Rspec FR - Bad light for auto seedlings/triggering early flowering?

Mozzy

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I think a couple folks on here have an HLG 260 Rspec FR :smokeout:...any thoughts on whether lights like this that are meant for flowering, due to (I assume) spectrum; should not be used on autos from seed or introduced to seedlings and plants in early veg due to triggering flowering early or other unintentional effects? Anyone experienced first-hand issues with lights like this? :baked:


HLG 260 Rspec FR is a 260W LED lamp and powered with our custom QB272 Quantum Boards®, an LED Module designed by Horticulture Lighting Group. Each board has Full Spectrum White LEDs, Deep Red 660nm LEDs, and Far Red 730nm LEDs.

Top Features

  • High efficiency custom QB272 Quantum Boards®
  • Reliable Passive-Cooled Design
  • Full Spectrum
  • Ideal for Flowering
  • External dimming
  • 120V Power Cord with Nema 5-15P Plug
  • 1 Year Warranty

Specifications

260 Watts
LEDFull Spectrum White, Deep Red, & Blue
Flowering Footprint2' x 4'
Veg FootprintNot Recommended for Veg
Recommended Mounting HeightAt least 15” Above Canopy
[td]Power[/td]
 
I have no idea on that but it is an interesting question. I does say "not recommended for veg" but I don' t know what effect that would have on autos. Seems like the sort of light you would have if you run multiple tents and move plants around.
 
The very top of the growlightcentral.com entry for this light says:

BUILT FOR FLOWERING - HLG 260 RSPEC FR DELIVERS PRECISION PPFD FOR MAXIMUM BUD DEVELOPMENT

So it's a bloom-optimized light, with plants capable of using more red in bloom phase. Best just used for plants in bloom.

If needed, it still is broad spectrum and white enough to support plants in grow phase, but they could well be stunted or stretched (whatever too much red does in the grow phase) vs. using the usual broad spectrum white-dominant light.
 
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The spectrum of light drives plant morphology (the shape and structure).

Plants flower because of the change in the number of hours of daylight.

The spectrum of a veg light has a high percentage of blue and a low percentage of red light whereas a white LED or a flower light has a low percentage of blue light and a high percentage of red light. Below are the spectra from my Growcraft lights:

1741730061230.png


The spectrum on the flower light has more red than an HPS light or some other dedicated flower lights but the idea is the same - lots of blue in veg and lots of red in flower.

The reason for this is that blue photons inhibit cell expansion so plants that are grow under veg lights tend to be short and stocky with lots of branches and limited internodal space. Flower lights, with the much lower percentage of blue, don't limit growth. Red diodes are very electrically efficient so, for a given input current, red diodes can generate a lot of photons. (730nm light ("far red"), not 660nm red ("deep red"), induces "cell expansion" but 730nm is not common in commodity grow lights.)

You can use a veg light from drop to chop as long as you're willing to accept that a plant grown under a veg light will be extremely short and will have a reduced yield. If you use a flower light from drop to chop, the plants will tend to be very tall and slender with large fans leaves.

Re yield and other factors - I've attached a few research papers on that topic that might be of interest.
 

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    Mozzy

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If you're looking for a good light for a 2' x 4', I would strongly recommend the Vipar G/SE4500.

I grow in a 2' x 4', have spent a lot of time learning about grow lights and grow lighting over the past four years (perhaps thousands of hours, frankly), and tried to find a light to replace my 2020 Growcraft flower light last summer. Based on what I see in the grow light market, I would go with the 4500.
 
I appreciate the detailed information and opinions :toke:

I've had the light for a while and it is a backup/second light to help in a 4x4 when too many plants get going or in case the main craps out at a bad time.

The other light (we'll call it the main) that the HLG periodically joins is a full spec 300w bar and did fine for many harvests in a 2x4 but I grow perpetually now in the bigger tent and routinely have a few plants at 2-3 stages of growth and prefer running both lights at 40-60% as opposed to the main at closer to 100% when the tent is full, but I didn't know if including the HLG in lighting while some plants are young is counter-productive due to the type of light.

If you use a flower light from drop to chop, the plants will tend to be very tall and slender with large fans leaves.

If this is my biggest issue for the plants that are at a small stage when I turn on the HLG for the bigger plants at that time, it's interesting and good to know but not a deal breaker unless I'm missing something... I'm just growing my own organic meds and I already top/schwazz/super-crop my autos as needed anyways, and never have issues not growing enough.

When I turn on the HLG, it's always next to the main/full spec bar light that is on which stays over the "young-side" of the tent. So maybe it is fine as the second light but should not be used solo seed-to-harvest if the main light dies :smokeout:
 
I appreciate the detailed information and opinions :toke:
You're welcome.

I've had the light for a while and it is a backup/second light to help in a 4x4 when too many plants get going or in case the main craps out at a bad time.

The other light (we'll call it the main) that the HLG periodically joins is a full spec 300w bar and did fine for many harvests in a 2x4 but I grow perpetually now in the bigger tent and routinely have a few plants at 2-3 stages of growth and prefer running both lights at 40-60% as opposed to the main at closer to 100% when the tent is full, but I didn't know if including the HLG in lighting while some plants are young is counter-productive due to the type of light.
Sounds like a nice setup!

"Counter productive" - far from it. In terms of yield in a cannabis grow, for a given wattage, a light with more red in it will tend to yield more than a light with a light that has a lower % of red. If you run through Bugbee's videos from a few years back, he describes it as light spectrum (he calls it "quality") drives plant shape while PPFD/DLI drives yield. In fact, the yield curve for cannabis (under LED) is based solely on the number of mols of light that the grow has received over the course of the grow.

If this is my biggest issue for the plants that are at a small stage when I turn on the HLG for the bigger plants at that time, it's interesting and good to know but not a deal breaker unless I'm missing something... I'm just growing my own organic meds and I already top/schwazz/super-crop my autos as needed anyways, and never have issues not growing enough.

When I turn on the HLG, it's always next to the main/full spec bar light that is on which stays over the "young-side" of the tent. So maybe it is fine as the second light but should not be used solo seed-to-harvest if the main light dies :smokeout:
The way you're using it now is perfectly fine and, if forced to, a grower could use it through the life of a grow ("flower" lights have enough blue in them to avoid misshapen plants). IIRC, one of the mods here, @Mañ'O'Green, uses/used to use a Growcraft flower light + a Rapid LED Royal Blue puck and gets excellent results.
 
You're welcome.


Sounds like a nice setup!

"Counter productive" - far from it. In terms of yield in a cannabis grow, for a given wattage, a light with more red in it will tend to yield more than a light with a light that has a lower % of red. If you run through Bugbee's videos from a few years back, he describes it as light spectrum (he calls it "quality") drives plant shape while PPFD/DLI drives yield. In fact, the yield curve for cannabis (under LED) is based solely on the number of mols of light that the grow has received over the course of the grow.


The way you're using it now is perfectly fine and, if forced to, a grower could use it through the life of a grow ("flower" lights have enough blue in them to avoid misshapen plants). IIRC, one of the mods here, @Mañ'O'Green, uses/used to use a Growcraft flower light + a Rapid LED Royal Blue puck and gets excellent results.
Thanks; low yield fortunately has not been a concern for a long time...now if there was a quality/effect difference, that would be another story, but I've been growing better than the stuff from dispensaries for a while now so it would be hard for me to judge at this point :baked:
 
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