Calling out bad Autoflower genetics/actors

They’re an overseas company after all.
I have read they are a US entity operating in overseas but that could be inaccurate.

Of course these designer strains aren’t going to be an exact replica of their photo counterparts
I hear you but I was simply pointing out that if a seed bank like FB is going to market an auto with that name, it should have some genetic connection to the original cultivar - or at least be transparent that it doesn't. Otherwise (as I believe the case is here) they are just "shoplifting the booty" (i.e. pilfering unprotected trade names from the actual breeder). While it may be strictly not illegal, it's not strictly above-board either.

Again, I am not slamming FB per se, (I have successfully grown their gear) just pointing out that they aren't a breeder but a private-label seed bank IMHO.
 
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FB could have access to a lab and be able to easily and quickly change gene expression
It's hard for me to believe the auto seed market can justify the expense of a Crispr lab, even if FB is the 500 lb. gorilla in the market. But hey - again I could be way off base here.
 
have read they are a US entity operating in overseas but that could be inaccurate.
Pretty sure they’re a European entity whose marketing ploy is “USA autos”….as in the popular Cali strains basically (not totally Cali strains….but you get it). We honestly have no information on weather they are an actual breeder or not….so I don’t see the need to speculate about that further…. :pass:
 
We honestly have no information on weather they are an actual breeder or not….so I don’t see the need to speculate about that further….

Cool - different stokes and all. For me, I like to know who the actual breeder is. And I don't think it's idle speculation to ask that question , especially since FB's marketing efforts obfuscate this issue.
 
I agree. I have had generally positive experiences growing FB gear. I guess what gets me confused is when people assume they are a breeder. I have strong doubts. To me, it looks like a seed bank with private label stock. That's it.

I would like to see some evidence that FB actually owns a plant, much less actual seed producing or breeding stock. They don't appear to me to have any real involvement in breeding as that term is commonly understood. They likely call up a breeder (probably one of the "five") and say - give me a Straw-nana in auto format, pronto! And said breeder crosses auto of some variety and a photo of a Straw-nana (presumably) - takes some steps to lock down traits and starts production. I just don't think FB (or any breeder/seed producer working for them) comes up with all their new cultivars (Wedding Cheesecake, Bruce Banner, Runtz, etc.) after multiple generations and/or pheno-hunting. It takes years from my understanding of it.

They are a marketing entity. There is not to say this is a bad thing - they may have exclusive contracts with breeders to develop their strains and the breeders may be fantastic. In fact, if I was going into the seed business I would probably use this business model. But I have little confidence that when I buy a seed of FB Bruce Banner Auto, for example, that cultivar is not being marketed under a different label with a different seed bank. I have very little confidence that the breeder (who remains unknown) actually used an original Bruce Banner photo to develop the cultivar (and with respect to this particular one, I am 99% sure).

Of course, I could be wrong and they have thousands of plants under cultivation and lots of employees who are working to lock down traits to bring new cultivars to market. I would just need to see some proof of that before I believed it. I just don't think we can accurately call them a breeder.

IMHO, etc.

You worded it way better than I could when I tried. I’ve had generally good experiences with them as well. Hell, I’ve got a FB indoor grow journal going on this site about the plant and I’ve had nothing but positive things to say about it.

My main point was that if a number of “seed companies” are sourcing the same seeds from the same breeding houses in Spain, renaming them, relabeling them, and offering them at different price points, then why would I want to pay the highest price? I spend enough money on this hobby that I see no need to be cultish about it. The companies mentioned certainly aren’t cultish about me.
 
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Imagine banging in some new genes in the lab, cut and paste, boom new strains quick and easy and stable.
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I don't think the market is ready yet for genetic sequence-modified seeds/strains, particularly the cutting and pasting in of genes from other plants/organisms. There just seems to be way too much ignorance and bias against genetically modified organisms. I think we can all agree that the first breeder(s) to start selling seeds containing foreign inserted genes will get seriously trashed, dumped on, criticized to no end, probably boycotted, etc.

What we will likely or presumably see first is CRISPR-type or other 'genetic modifications' where the natural gene sequence is left unaltered (no cut/paste-type genetic modification) but with certain genes turned-off/inhibited or turned-on/stimulated. I'm surprised and very disappointed that we don't have such seeds available now. Or maybe such seeds are now being marketed, but breeders aren't disclosing this, with them rightly fearful of the GEM (genetically modified) label and not reporting their use of CRISPR or other modern biotechnology methods.

Just wait. In a few more years (presumablyl) when synthetic biology kits come along we will hopefully have the option of cell culturing and/or enzymatic synthesis of our own custom cannabinoid/terpene products. Growing from seeds will not be the only way for individuals to make their own pure or mixture cannabinoid/terpene products.
 
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Now this cannot be used to judge any particular auto. Some times one may need a boost, put it on 12/12 for a couple days, and occasionally they just won't at all. It's when you get 9 out of ten that don't auto ( I had that happen ) that you know you got rooked. 1 in 10 says the seeds were at best F2! But photo periods have there own innate issues also, hermies for instance. Some times its stress, sometimes it's ( mostly Sativa hybrids and pure South East Asian ) genetic. And occasionally it's just piss poor breeding. But you can't point to a single incident and say that's a crap strain. the plants themselves decide what genetic expression they will present.



Shit like this is why I created this thread.
 
I would not have thought gene manipulation and sequencing was prevalent at all but the Dinafem bust revealed that to be true.

First paragraph talks about it:
 
I would not have thought gene manipulation and sequencing was prevalent at all but the Dinafem bust revealed that to be true.

First paragraph talks about it:
Yes - I read that too. Would be interested in knowing really how much gene sequencing was actually being conducted. I'm not geneticist (far from it) but my understanding is that the capital investment needed is substantial. Maybe Dinafem (or another breeder) had enough revenue stream to justify that kind of outlay but I have significant doubts.
 
Now this cannot be used to judge any particular auto. Some times one may need a boost, put it on 12/12 for a couple days, and occasionally they just won't at all. It's when you get 9 out of ten that don't auto ( I had that happen ) that you know you got rooked. 1 in 10 says the seeds were at best F2! But photo periods have there own innate issues also, hermies for instance. Some times its stress, sometimes it's ( mostly Sativa hybrids and pure South East Asian ) genetic. And occasionally it's just piss poor breeding. But you can't point to a single incident and say that's a crap strain. the plants themselves decide what genetic expression they will present.

My intent was not to single out a crap strain, but to point to an example of “WTF” I’m seeing on Reddit semi-regularly in the auto space. This was just the latest example that came across yesterday. I’m not saying it’s definitely crap, or that FB sells all crap, or anything like it. It just checked all the boxes of red flags. Doesn’t 100% mean it sucks, but it’s not a great sign either!
 
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