New Grower Potential underfeeding

[Giant Flying Wombat]

Hey guys,

Seeing lower leaves dying off, yellowing and rusty spots. Other leaves showing what almost looks like a rash.

Both girls same strain, dps compassion cbd lime. Finding they’re growing out completely differently and seemingly went into flower very early. Currently at day 36/37.

Grow medium canna terra professional in 5 gal pots.

Feed bio canna range, Vega, Flores, boost and rhizo, plus mammoth p supplement. I’ll post some pics of the nute bottles.
Feeding has been a little over the place, been away etc. initially thought the soil was hot so didn’t feed till day 22. Growth was great but slowed down a little last week or two.
Day 22 First feed was at ec 0.3 ph 6.4 Vega 1.2ml 0.5ml rhizo in 2.4 litres water between the two
Day 27 feed ec 0.4 ph 6.4 Vega 4.5ml 1.25ml rhizo 0.8ml mam p in 5 litres between the two
Day 30 feed ec 0.5 ph 6.4 Vega 8ml boost 8ml 2ml rhizo 1.3ml mam p in 8 litres between the two
Day 35 feed ec 0.7 ph 6.3 Vega 15mls, 15ml boost 2.8ml rhizo 2ml mam p in 10 litres, took about 4 litres each till 10% run off.
Been feeding without watering in between.

Water source is tap with a background ec of O. I bubble for at least 24 hours. Ph floats up to about 8 when left for long. Feed mix usually brings that down to 6.3-6.4.

Climate: mins 20.5c rh30%
Max 29c Rh 50%+ (rh spikes after feeding)

Lights: 2 x 100watt cobs 3500k (optic1xl’s) and a system with 2 x 55watt cobs 3000k and 5000k and IR/UV diodes (optic2)

Initially, during second week I noticed some leaf tip clawing, this is what led me to think the soil was too hot. Growth was great though so topped and lst’d.
Girl no.2 is worse affected, and seems to be hurrying with flowering, hardly no work on secondary branching but thickening up buds and frosting. Her top leaves look rather dark in colour.
No.1 is much bushier with more heads but behind on bud development. She’s got a little yellowing on lower leaves but not nearly as dramatic as no.2.


Bottled nutes
Vega

Flores

Boost- doesn’t give a breakdown, I can smell the molasses though.

Rhizo

No.1

No.2

Medczech was quick to point out I needed to start feeding. Since then I’ve been slowly working my way up with ec and waiting for pots to become light before another feed. Possibly still to lighthanded though

Appreciate all and any advice!!
Thanks guys!

 

[Mr Green Fingers]

I'm no expert but looks like she needs some calcium and a PK boost but wait for the experts to come and take a look!

 

[Giant Flying Wombat]

I'm no expert but looks like she needs some calcium and a PK boost but wait for the experts to come and take a look!

Thanks for the lookin bro. I’ve had similar advice on my journal, PK seems to be the issue, poor girls starving on me! Switching to bloom nutes today and gonna bump it up to higher ec levels. Possibly do a flush before but I’m unsure on that yet.
Cheers bud

 

[Waira]

'Bats --- I think you need a solid PK booster, especially P,..... I'm with Chro' here, looking at the nutes' NPK #'s, it's seriously lacking IMO,... I see symptoms of P defc. starting (yellowing, wasting, patchy discoloring and necrosis), mixed in with some normal yellowing in lowers (N defc., more like tapping out from the leaf stores),...
... I see little to no Ca or Mg, micronutes in the nutes? Not sure what the labeling deal is with them,... but with that soft water, I'd start using a Ca-Mg product, and a micronutrient supplement too, just for prevention's sake,... micro's play huge roles in the cellular machinery,... And from what I've learned, plants can suffer from defc's well before showing outward symptoms, but still suffer consequences from them,... Now, I don't see such symptoms now, but it would be wise to look into getting them,... Question is what you can get where you live!

 

[Giant Flying Wombat]

'Bats --- I think you need a solid PK booster, especially P,..... I'm with Chro' here, looking at the nutes' NPK #'s, it's seriously lacking IMO,... I see symptoms of P defc. starting (yellowing, wasting, patchy discoloring and necrosis), mixed in with some normal yellowing in lowers (N defc., more like tapping out from the leaf stores),...
... I see little to no Ca or Mg, micronutes in the nutes? Not sure what the labeling deal is with them,... but with that soft water, I'd start using a Ca-Mg product, and a micronutrient supplement too, just for prevention's sake,... micro's play huge roles in the cellular machinery,... And from what I've learned, plants can suffer from defc's well before showing outward symptoms, but still suffer consequences from them,... Now, I don't see such symptoms now, but it would be wise to look into getting them,... Question is what you can get where you live!

Thanks for the look in bro.
Can’t quite figure out why a cannabis focused company is making nutes without the necessities, very frustrating from a beginners point of view. I’m trying to stay organic and this is pretty much the best option I found, I’m sure there’s others that I missed, just don’t want to bin a whole bunch of nutes, not so cheap!
The cal mag I’m thinking of using pharmaceutical grade Epsom salts if that’ll work. I see most people foliar feed with it, but thinking I’m a bit too deep into flowering for it. Possible to water it in with the nute mix?
I’ll have a look into potential pk boosters, he no’s here in Oz and grows organic so I’ll pm him and ask. I am using mammoth p, doesn’t add p but supposedly helps unlock it, guess there’s got to be p in the first place for it to work though!
Yesterday I moved onto bloom nutes and upped ec to 1.2. Ph run off 6.3 if I remember rightly so don’t think it’s lockout. Have an accurate 8 arriving in the post for better measurements but being in soil and organic it shouldn’t be of too much concern.
Thanks again bud!

 

[BII]

Thanks for the look in bro.
...The cal mag I’m thinking of using pharmaceutical grade Epsom salts if that’ll work. I see most people foliar feed with it, but thinking I’m a bit too deep into flowering for it. Possible to water it in with the nute mix?...

Epsom salts (MgSO4) only provides magnesium (and some sulfur too), does nothing for calcium. Yes, just add at levels you see being used in AFN.

As a fellow COB user, I think you definitely need to also add calcium, if only as a preventative. And you will likely need to purchase a cannabis-oriented cal-mag product. Other calcium sources, such as lye, egg shells, etc. either have major risks, are hard to control, or take too long.

 

[Giant Flying Wombat]

Epsom salts (MgSO4) only provides magnesium (and some sulfur too), does nothing for calcium. Yes, just add at levels you see being used in AFN.

As a fellow COB user, I think you definitely need to also add calcium, if only as a preventative. And you will likely need to purchase a cannabis-oriented cal-mag product. Other calcium sources, such as lye, egg shells, etc. either have major risks, are hard to control, or take too long.

I’ve actually got a bottle of general hydroponics cal mag, but found it scorched my last grow as I didn’t have an ec pen. Now that I do though I can add a small dose in with every feed see if that helps. Just don’t want to use it unless absolutely necessary.
Cheers pal

 

[Waira]

...Hec' likes the Bloom line of nutes, among some others,.. go to his organic thread, a few pages back is a pic of his nute stash!
..The current nutes may have them but not listed..? Different country, different regulations = ... it would be literally stupid to not have complete coverage in the nutrient, but it's common to have the line-up in multiple bottles, partly because not all nutrient ions play well together!
..good on the r-o pH, I think... depends on what the input pH was; run-off in not a good measure of actual in-pot pH,....

 

[BII]

Now that I do though I can add a small dose in with every feed see if that helps. Just don’t want to use it unless absolutely necessary.

Check with others, but I think that is the wrong approach, attitude, etc. You feed every other critical nute rather constantly and at rather good concentrations, to prevent deficiencies. Why is Ca and Mg different?

I and many or most other COB users use rather constant cal-mag feeding to prevent related deficiencies, with not using this regularly seemingly always leading to problems, with permanent damage done by the time you start to see cal-mag deficiencies.

 

[Giant Flying Wombat]

...Hec' likes the Bloom line of nutes, among some others,.. go to his organic thread, a few pages back is a pic of his nute stash!
..The current nutes may have them but not listed..? Different country, different regulations = ... it would be literally stupid to not have complete coverage in the nutrient, but it's common to have the line-up in multiple bottles, partly because not all nutrient ions play well together!
..good on the r-o pH, I think... depends on what the input pH was; run-off in not a good measure of actual in-pot pH,....

Sent him a message and got the full lineup, may be a little beyond my skills mixing that all up into the perfect blend, for now anyway!
You’d think a cannabis focused company like CANNA would have it all thought out! Whatever the case, they’ve responded pretty well to the bloom feeds, no.1 now starting to trich up and no.2 getting thicker n thicker. Think I’ll be alright, just have to keep increasing those amounts.
Ph input always around 6.3-6.4, so making sense to me. Still waiting on this accurate 8, probably to far gone by the time it arrives, oh well.
Cheers pal