Anytime you run into ph problems like this your first action should be to flush. Run 10 times the volume of the pot worth of water through your pot. If your tap water is around ph7 I guarantee this will put your ph where it's supposed to be. There is no point in flushing with nutes. You're just wasting it. After you properly flush your plant then add your nutrients at the proper PH level. I would go 6.5 on the high end since it seems you're soil is going to want to go down.
Possible Mg/Ca deficiencies
- Thread starter BillyWu
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Well. Then they obviously don't know what the f*** their talking about, or their product is shit or both.ive had this problem for 5 weeks done my head in even pm muddy about it . jtang, si have also had problem aswell all biobizz light soil so i emailed biobizz yesterday,and there responceu cant use chemical ph up and down with their organics liquids it kills micros they told me mix ur nutes the ph should be between 6.5 and 7.5 water and ur run off will be perfectsj
I don't see how adjusting the ph of you feed will harm any micro's. I would think that a soil ph of around 4 would hurt micro's though.
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KindredSpirit
AFN New Growers Mod
From the way I read that, I don't think they were saying that the pH of the water with which you feed would harm the micros. I took that to say that using CHEMICAL pH up and down will harm the microherd - which makes sense. Using traditional chemical nutrients or chemical anything harms your microherd.
Even if I'm wrong and they intended to mean your interpretation Tavi, I believe that the pH of the water you feed can still have an effect on the microherd. If you water with something pH'd to be very acidic or very basic, that's definitely not optimal conditions in which those microherd can thrive.
Just my
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yep... bottom line is nutrient uptake:
Yeah, I hear ya. I'm not saying to dump a half a bottle of ph up into the soil. Soil ph should be somewhere between 6.2-6.5. There seems to be a pretty good range that the micro herd can thrive in being that people consistently complain about their organic soil ph dropping close to 4 after a few waterings (this being the case with multiple brands so I'm assuming the company designed it that way), and the companies recommendation to water with regular ph 7 water. If the herd can take a 4.0 hit, and a 7.0 hit it's pretty hardy and shouldn't be bothered by ph adjusted feeding within that range to maintain balanced runoff ph readings. I could be wrong, and probably am but it works for me. I've never given it a second thought to ph the feedings of my outdoor plants. I'll put my life savings down that I would have problems if I didn't.
All I'm saying is that there has to be an easy answer. If someone doesn't like the "checmical" ph buffers, then use natural stuff. Either way, if you've got a ph problem it needs to be fixed or it'll kill your shit for sure and a lot faster than using chemical ph buffers. Again, I don't grow much in soil, but it works for me when I do.
Peace.
All I'm saying is that there has to be an easy answer. If someone doesn't like the "checmical" ph buffers, then use natural stuff. Either way, if you've got a ph problem it needs to be fixed or it'll kill your shit for sure and a lot faster than using chemical ph buffers. Again, I don't grow much in soil, but it works for me when I do.
Peace.
KindredSpirit
AFN New Growers Mod
Hmmm... I haven't heard these people constantly complaining about organic soil dropping down to a pH of 4. The few cases I have seen were a result of the inputs that went in, not using properly pH'd water, or because they didn't use a reputable brand name for their soil.
I would definitely disagree that any organic soil is designed to drop to a pH of 4.0. I'm not aware of more than a handful of species of plants that can survive being subjected to that pH for any length of time. Most reputable companies pH buffer their medium to be in the optimal pH range for the majority of plants (6.0-7.0). This isn't to say that there haven't been bad batches of soil from some of these companies that have been way out of range, but those were the exceptions and certainly not the norm.
Just because the herd can survive a quick hit of pH 4.0 doesn't mean that it's good for the herd or that it doesn't greatly diminish the colonies of all the different species in your microherd. I agree, if you mess up a watering and drop your soil down to pH of 4.0 for a day, and then immediately fix it and bring it back into range - the damage to the microherd might be negligible. But it would take watering with a pH of pretty much 1.0 to drop your pH down to 4.0 over the course of one day... which means it's a problem that has happened over time, and the microherd has without a doubt been suffering. The microherd is what breaks down the nutrients in your soil and makes them available to the plant. pH out --> decreased microherd --> no means of transport to bring the nutrients to your plants --> deficiencies.
Unless you're growing in containers when you grow outside, you have the entire ecosystem of the soil helping to supply the microherd for your plants and helping to maintain the proper pH of the soil via a shiteload of interactions and relationships between tons of entities in the entire ecosystem. Watering a plant that's in the ground outside with a pH of 4.0 will have a vastly different effect than watering a 1 gallon pot inside with a pH of 4.0.
:smokebuds:
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I've always grown in containers, and with pretty good results. The only time I've ever had deficiencies is when the PH is off. Check out the pictures of the purple donkey dick plant(actually don't, I abused the FUCK out of that plant but it survived). I'm no organic grower although I use organic bases for my soil mix. I still use straight chemical ferts, and ph up and down along with beneficial micros which are designed for hydro and soil so.....
All I'm saying is that if you have bad batch of orgainic soil, or your ph is off you need to correct it. It's a great organic mix when all you have to do is water with plain tap water, but it's not always that way.
I don't understand why people think that ph buffers in a nutrient solution of ph 6.2-6.5 hurts the micro herd. Is it fact that ph Up or Down are lethal in any quantity to the herd? They make beneficial micro's for use in soil, and hydro knowing that hydro most definitely is buffered with chemicals. Are the benefits of using it to correct the PH if need be outweighed by the effect it will have on the micro herd in a shitty or abused organic soil? I would definitely ph my water, and feedings to say 6.0 if that's what it took to keep my runoff at around 6.2-6.5. That's what it's all about isn't it? Getting dialed into your shit to get the best results? If your having to "feed" your organic mix you could say to hell with the herd. Is coming from a "I won't use ANY chemicals" view, or a "PH buffers kill your micro herd no matter in what quantity they are used" perspective? I can understand the first one, but the second one I'm not sure about. I'm a noob, and definitely not an organic grower, but I do know that the micros I've bought can be used in hydro, or soil. Unless the organic manufactures use different stuff... Again, I'm probably wrong but that's what I've got, lol.
If BillyWu isn't confused now....
Sorry man. Hope some of this helped.
:thumbs:
Peace.
Tav
All I'm saying is that if you have bad batch of orgainic soil, or your ph is off you need to correct it. It's a great organic mix when all you have to do is water with plain tap water, but it's not always that way.
I don't understand why people think that ph buffers in a nutrient solution of ph 6.2-6.5 hurts the micro herd. Is it fact that ph Up or Down are lethal in any quantity to the herd? They make beneficial micro's for use in soil, and hydro knowing that hydro most definitely is buffered with chemicals. Are the benefits of using it to correct the PH if need be outweighed by the effect it will have on the micro herd in a shitty or abused organic soil? I would definitely ph my water, and feedings to say 6.0 if that's what it took to keep my runoff at around 6.2-6.5. That's what it's all about isn't it? Getting dialed into your shit to get the best results? If your having to "feed" your organic mix you could say to hell with the herd. Is coming from a "I won't use ANY chemicals" view, or a "PH buffers kill your micro herd no matter in what quantity they are used" perspective? I can understand the first one, but the second one I'm not sure about. I'm a noob, and definitely not an organic grower, but I do know that the micros I've bought can be used in hydro, or soil. Unless the organic manufactures use different stuff... Again, I'm probably wrong but that's what I've got, lol.
If BillyWu isn't confused now....
Sorry man. Hope some of this helped.
:thumbs:
Peace.
Tav
ok i sent 2 emails and they sent back two. their first asked did i use ph i replied yes and heres their responce. well that explains everything.please do not use ph anymore.this is only important when u grow with mineral nutes.if the ph level with a mineral nute is not ok the nute crystal will not desolve and cannot be absorbed. with organics it works differently.they enter the soil, start to decompose and are in that way made available for the plant. you feed the soil the soil feeds the plant.due to this decomposing process the ph is balanced naturally.it is not about the ph of the water you give,it is about the ph of the soil.the rest does not matter.take some water,add the recommended dosage of bio bizz and then measure the ph.is it between6.5-7.5?your good to go. ph actually kills more than you think especially when you grow with 100% organics.the natural lime,bacteria and micro-organisms are killed and there is no life in the soil,it can no longer keep the ph at a good level.so now you also understand why biobizz fishmix and biogrow do not work on hydro and coco.we need soil to do trick.hope this answers your questions good luck........ greetings biobizz
G
GoTgReEn
Guest
This is interesting ... ... I also use there products with ph up and down..... Always run into deficiencies!!
Based on my experience with the GO Box and more recently TLO growing, I think if you start with a proper soil composition and CHLORINE/CHLORAMINE free water (RO/Distilled/Natural Spring/Well/Rain) you'll have good results. When you use any kind of tap water that has not been filtered (even if left out to evaporate) you're going to start seeing deficiency problems in an organic grow. If you read up on some of the organic Cannabis guru websites, they all say that the cornerstone of any successful organic grow is good water. Even a heavy-feeding plant should do pretty well in most of the organic soils people use with just a little water added, no nutes or additives, assuming the container is nice and large. I have a Himalayan Blue Diesel (Short Stuff Seeds) in a 10Q pot right now with just a basic soil mix and some organic fertilizer spikes...I'm incredibly anal about water quality and as a result she's grown a MASSIVE center cola and about 8 smaller side colas with about 70 total minutes of gardening invested in her (41 days old right now, almost a meter tall). Having used the GO box unsuccessfully with several soil mixes and tap water, I'm convinced the RO I bought is the source of my success. Water ends up with a background ppm in the mid teens at almost exactly pH 7.0 by the time it's filtered and has rested for a day. I keep a 5gal bucket full at all times in my grow room so I have fresh, clean, filtered water at all times.
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