Photo SOG questions

[oldnewbdude]

Alright so I'm planning out my first photosensitive run and I'm really trying to do all my homework before I get started. It will be a while yet as I've got a few autos underway to finish and my plan is to start a mother and get some clones from her. I will probably kill some clones at first but once I get a few successfully rooted I want to do a mini SOG style garden in my 1.5 x 3ft tent. I will likely run the clones in coco as that is what I've cut my teeth on. I need advice about some particular aspects.
So for my newb questions:

1) What would be the easiest medium for keeping the mother? I love coco but the thought of a plant that might hang around for a long life that needs everyday attention seems daunting.

2) How many cuts do you think I can flower in the 1.5x3ft space? I was thinking starting with 3 to be safe and not overcrowded. Sound reasonable? Or should I try more?

3) What size pots would you suggest for the cuts? I definitely don't want to run 3 gallon as I'm currently using, both because I think the pots will take up too much space and I'm afraid that amount of root mass will lead to excessively large plants. Would 1 gallon suffice or will I be shorting myself on potential yields?

4) Should I try to flower cuts from more than one mother at the same time? My overall goal is a pheno hunt through a few seeds of the same strain and find my keeper momma. Could I flower a cut from say 3 different individuals to compare their performance or should I do all cuts from one individual per each run. I worry that if the phenotypes end up significantly different than each other they won't get the same access to light and resources and might not show the true abilities of each pheno. Or am I just worrying too much about all of it?

5) Am I doing this backwards? Should I run the whole plant out first and clip clones off her to keep for mothers if she looks like a keeper? See what her full potential is first?

Sorry I know that's a lot but thanks for the help and any advice y'all got for me. I'm chomping at the bit to try this but it feels like a big leap from one or two autos to a mother and clone SOGish situation. Im gonna moral support lol.

 

[Death The Cultivator]

1 - I use Growpito for my mothers and cloning. I water every 3 days.

2 - If you're doing a true SOG it is 4 plants per square foot so you would need 18 in your space

3 - I would figure out how many pots you can fit, square preferably, and divide 18 by the amount of pots you can manage. You won't be vegging more than two weeks ideally so a large root mass isn't a problem.

4- I have the same dilemma but I've only found one pheno I love so far. I don't really want to grow it with other strains. Either way will work depending on your goals.

5 - What I've been doing is germinating seeds then letting them grow out until I can clone them. If I need plants to fill my space in general then I take mothers that I already have clones of and flower them. So I've tried mothers before clones but not intentionally. I don't think you'll get the best in the first run but by repeating your success with a particular strain you'll find it's genetic potential.

My biggest issue, literally the only thing fucking me, is cloning. I went from an aerocloner with a 90% rate to this Growpito and using a dome. My success rate is about 70% though. The underlying is for me is that keeping mothers is work for me. I took roughly 15 cuts from two mothers of the same strain but the clones of one mother rooted in 7 days while the other mother took 15. The first mother is incredibly healthy while the second is as well but smaller in general.

Growing like this has forced me to get better but even now I was supposed to be flowering but I only have 8/36 clones rooted lol. My last grow was almost two weeks ago and I'm still waiting for clones.

Here are my mother and some clones.

 

[oldnewbdude]

1 - I use Growpito for my mothers and cloning. I water every 3 days.

2 - If you're doing a true SOG it is 4 plants per square foot so you would need 18 in your space

3 - I would figure out how many pots you can fit, square preferably, and divide 18 by the amount of pots you can manage. You won't be vegging more than two weeks ideally so a large root mass isn't a problem.

4- I have the same dilemma but I've only found one pheno I love so far. I don't really want to grow it with other strains. Either way will work depending on your goals.

5 - What I've been doing is germinating seeds then letting them grow out until I can clone them. If I need plants to fill my space in general then I take mothers that I already have clones of and flower them. So I've tried mothers before clones but not intentionally. I don't think you'll get the best in the first run but by repeating your success with a particular strain you'll find it's genetic potential.

My biggest issue, literally the only thing fucking me, is cloning. I went from an aerocloner with a 90% rate to this Growpito and using a dome. My success rate is about 70% though. The underlying is for me is that keeping mothers is work for me. I took roughly 15 cuts from two mothers of the same strain but the clones of one mother rooted in 7 days while the other mother took 15. The first mother is incredibly healthy while the second is as well but smaller in general.

Growing like this has forced me to get better but even now I was supposed to be flowering but I only have 8/36 clones rooted lol. My last grow was almost two weeks ago and I'm still waiting for clones.

Here are my mother and some clones.

View attachment 1188315View attachment 1188316

Thank you so much for this info. I'll look into the growpito. Sounds interesting from what I read so far. Holy shit man I would be so terrified to run 18 cuts in that space so maybe I'll up my initial 3 a good bit but I might wait a few cycles to max it out. I'm definitely concerned about the cloning. I dont have currently or really desire to run an aero or bubble setup but I might end up with it out of necessity. I have a humidity dome setup with like 72 cells, gonna try that with rooter plugs first. I'm planning to keep some autos going in my other tent to keep myself supplied with meds. I'm real new to cannabis growing, just about to pull my first girl down in a few days. Probably biting off more than I can chew but that's why I'm trying to get ahead of the learning curve. Thanks again for all the advice. I guess I need to start working on my cloning first and foremost.

 

[Death The Cultivator]

Thank you so much for this info. I'll look into the growpito. Sounds interesting from what I read so far. Holy shit man I would be so terrified to run 18 cuts in that space so maybe I'll up my initial 3 a good bit but I might wait a few cycles to max it out. I'm definitely concerned about the cloning. I dont have currently or really desire to run an aero or bubble setup but I might end up with it out of necessity. I have a humidity dome setup with like 72 cells, gonna try that with rooter plugs first. I'm planning to keep some autos going in my other tent to keep myself supplied with meds. I'm real new to cannabis growing, just about to pull my first girl down in a few days. Probably biting off more than I can chew but that's why I'm trying to get ahead of the learning curve. Thanks again for all the advice. I guess I need to start working on my cloning first and foremost.

Look into Dewey Misters if you want to build an aerocloner but I also use a 72 cell tray as I felt it was unnecessary to have extra hydro systems. This is easier.

Check out Harley Smith videos on cloning and growing.

Have a look at Ace Seeds for some good stock to start with. I've grown their Malawi x Panama and Zamaldelica x Kali China. They both cloned easy with good quality. I like their genetics more than anyone else's lol.

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That is my blog currently for my cloning and soon SOG grow lol. HMU whenever and food luck

 

[Proph]

My response is based on the assumption that you have two separate tents.. One for veg and one for flower.. Otherwise, your actual plan won't be possible..


1. It depends on what you are good at as a grower. One medium is not "easier" than any other. Since you're learning coco, I'd stick with that.

2. 1.5ft x 3ft is missing a dimension. If that is W and L, I'd say one clone is enough. You can determine the final size of a photo plant by how long you veg it before flip. Most photo periods have a pretty big stretch period as well. You will quickly run out of space in a 1.5 x 3ft space even with just one plant.

3. Photo period yield is based around pot size and veg time. I've never ran a photo period in anything less than 3 gal pots. I can't imagine getting more than a few grams off of a 1 gallon pot in that small of a space. You might be disappointed by the results of that scenario.

4. A pheno hunt is a long process that involves testing the plants at different stages. One of those stages is finished product. Why would you spend the time, money and energy taking cuts and growing out a strain that you haven't flowered out yet or tested the final product of? See where Im going? Most people take cuts the night/week before they flip the plant to flower.. Then they flower the mom plant and test the final product. If it checks all the boxes they want, they run the clone.. If the final product sucks, they throw away the clone. No need to keep a clone of a plant you don't like the final smoke of. If you have 3 mom plants.. Then take 2 cuts of each.. Flower out the moms.. Assess them.. Test the final product of each.. Then keep the clones of the best one.

5. See above answer, lol.

 

[oldnewbdude]

My response is based on the assumption that you have two separate tents.. One for veg and one for flower.. Otherwise, your actual plan won't be possible..


1. It depends on what you are good at as a grower. One medium is not "easier" than any other. Since you're learning coco, I'd stick with that.

2. 1.5ft x 3ft is missing a dimension. If that is W and L, I'd say one clone is enough. You can determine the final size of a photo plant by how long you veg it before flip. Most photo periods have a pretty big stretch period as well. You will quickly run out of space in a 1.5 x 3ft space even with just one plant.

3. Photo period yield is based around pot size and veg time. I've never ran a photo period in anything less than 3 gal pots. I can't imagine getting more than a few grams off of a 1 gallon pot in that small of a space. You might be disappointed by the results of that scenario.

4. A pheno hunt is a long process that involves testing the plants at different stages. One of those stages is finished product. Why would you spend the time, money and energy taking cuts and growing out a strain that you haven't flowered out yet or tested the final product of? See where Im going? Most people take cuts the night/week before they flip the plant to flower.. Then they flower the mom plant and test the final product. If it checks all the boxes they want, they run the clone.. If the final product sucks, they throw away the clone. No need to keep a clone of a plant you don't like the final smoke of. If you have 3 mom plants.. Then take 2 cuts of each.. Flower out the moms.. Assess them.. Test the final product of each.. Then keep the clones of the best one.

5. See above answer, lol.

Okay now I'm starting to see the picture. No wonder you'd need 18 clones if you're gonna flip them with very little veg for SOG to pay off. I was kinda thinking I had it backwards with the mother and clone and who you flowered out first. I definitely know this is gonna be a long process trying to grow through them and find something I like. I guess I was hoping to manage height vs yield by running higher counts of small plants, you're correct the missing dimension in 5.25ft H. Deffo worried about the stetchies with the photo runs. I wanna dive straight into strains I know I shouldn't but I will start with some of the more squat strains to get my feet under me. I do have a veg area and a flower area. I actually have two tents other than the veg closet but hoping to keep running some autos in it while I get the other side figured out. The other tent is 3x3x6.5 and will probably end up with the photos in it eventually. Yield isn't a huge priority especially at first but I don't wanna work for 3-4 months for a few grams of course. Thanks for your advice, I will probably take it and just try to grow out one from seed before falling deeper in the rabbit hole.

 

[Mustang92]

You can top your mothers first round of cloning to control height.
If you pack your mothers in you get only good clones up top of plant because no light gets down. So no matter how many you decide on, make sure you can get light lower because i find the lower branches are best for rooting(just me could be wrong).
I like mothers in dirt(i use promix) because you can be meaner to them when you want to slow growing down when you don't need them.
Like Proph says you need to grow them take a clone and sit on it until you smoke it.
I have not done it myself, but I have seen hybrid plant from same strain go more sativa dominate or indica dominate. I had a plant way way way way back in the day called juicy fruit, i believe they call it fruity juice if you buy seeds so, they don't get sued. I bought as clones from another guy but it would either grow tall and lanky sativa like or shorter bushy indica like.

 

[oldnewbdude]

You can top your mothers first round of cloning to control height.
If you pack your mothers in you get only good clones up top of plant because no light gets down. So no matter how many you decide on, make sure you can get light lower because i find the lower branches are best for rooting(just me could be wrong).
I like mothers in dirt(i use promix) because you can be meaner to them when you want to slow growing down when you don't need them.
Like Proph says you need to grow them take a clone and sit on it until you smoke it.
I have not done it myself, but I have seen hybrid plant from same strain go more sativa dominate or indica dominate. I had a plant way way way way back in the day called juicy fruit, i believe they call it fruity juice if you buy seeds so, they don't get sued. I bought as clones from another guy but it would either grow tall and lanky sativa like or shorter bushy indica like.

Thanks for the info. Im figuring topping probably will be a necessity with my height to get any decent veg time. I like the idea of soil for a mother or clone/possible mother, once I get that far down the road. I'm fairly experienced with soil container gardening however not with cannabis, and not hand watering everyday for these plants sounds very appealing.

 

[Mustang92]

remember to go easy on the clone soil, they don't like it to strong early, maybe half or less of what you use for mothers soil mix. I find most people get good success on getting roots but going from dome to soil is hard part without them wilting.

I don't know much about coco but starting your rooted clones in coco might be the best way to transplant I'm thinking. Thats what I'm going to start using next round of cloning because it seems smarter way to control your soil strength/nuts so you don't shock the hell out of the clones. I'm sure the guys who swear by coco can give better info but thats the direction i'd like to try next round of clones.

note: ALL my cloning experience is with photo plants I've never cloned auto's yet. The first time i cloned way back 1983-84 my buddy taught me, i was like 90% on getting roots. But then people told me I was doing it wrong and I changed and used all the fancy starters nuts, special nuts for mothers before cutting, and final cut under water, etc........ my success rate went from 90% to 70-60% .
My buddies way was plain and simple; nothing but plain old ph'd water for mothers(never found using anything else matters one bit to help success before taking clones) and plain ph'd water for rockwell cubes, storage container with two 20watt tube lights on lid , warm place in house, misting bottle , pellets or cubes and a cloning gel ( i have dipped clones multi-times right out of cloning gel container for two months straight and i've used seperate container for dipping gel , and either way didn't seem to matter for success rates and even after two months of multi dipping my gel container still gave roots.)

p.s. i must admit i do soak my cloning cube/pellet in a starter nut at half power.

 

[oldnewbdude]

I'm gonna try to keep it as simple as possible until I see something isn't working for me. Prolly grow the main plant/ potential mom in coco since that's what I know. Cut, gel dip, rooter plugs, dome is already plenty of stuff to keep up with for my old brain.