Indoor Grow #2: Bruce Banner & Creme de la Chem x Forum Stomper

[olegren]

Time for my second grow. I'm going to try and keep this thread a little more concise. Probably weekly (or at least not daily) updates and just the highlights - with the exception that I'll deep dive on any issues.


Gear:

• HLG 260W QB Kit (2x QB88 V1)
• Humidifier, oscillating fan, humidstat, 6" exhaust & passive intake. Carbon filter to be placed in line once we hit the stank phase.
• Happy Frog + Perilite in Smart Pots (3 gal) - After transplanting from solo cups
• Prescription Blend nutes starting week 1.5 (~Day 10 -- first feeding after transplant to 3gal pots)

Strains:

• 2x Bruce Banner Auto from Southern Oregon Seeds (E1 & E2 labels)
• 2x Forgotten Cookies x Creme de la Chem from Mephisto (E3 & E4 labels)

Water:

• Edit: I'm scrapping my A/B test. The more I think on it, the sillier it seems to subject plants to our unfiltered hard water. This had to be a factor in my problems with previous grows.
  • I'll be using store-bought RO water initially
  • I recently ordered an RO filter to produce my own.
  • Also looking into Rainwater harvesting. Will update separately on that front as the project evolves.
• All water will be PH'ed to 6.2-6.5 and given the same dosage of Prescription Blend nutes.

Week 1

Minimal updates for today. Really just wanted to kick this thread off and share the details of what I'm doing. The girls are 8 days old today and doing well. 4 of 4 successfully germinated just by throwing them in some wet soil and leaving them in the dark for a couple days. I did sprinkle a little myco in there to jumpstart the root situation. I didn't bother with the heat mat this time since it's staying around 72 degrees in there in the dark.

Both Mephistos took an extra day to sprout, but they are catching up nicely. I am going to go ahead and mix up their new pots today; but will probably wait a couple more days before I transplant. Light remains dimmed fully and around 28" above. Stretching is minimal. I'm going to be extremely cautious with light this time, as I'm not positive my previous issues weren't at least partially light burn.

Thanks for reading!

 

[derek420colorado]

Time for my second grow. I'm going to try and keep this thread a little more concise. Probably weekly (or at least not daily) updates and just the highlights - with the exception that I'll deep dive on any issues.


Gear:

• HLG 260W QB Kit (2x QB88 V1)
• Humidifier, oscillating fan, humidstat, 6" exhaust & passive intake. Carbon filter to be placed in line once we hit the stank phase.
• Happy Frog + Perilite in Smart Pots (3 gal) - After transplanting from solo cups
• Prescription Blend nutes starting week 1.5 (~Day 10 -- first feeding after transplant to 3gal pots)

Strains:

• 2x Bruce Banner Auto from Southern Oregon Seeds (E1 & E2 labels)
• 2x Forgotten Cookies x Creme de la Chem from Mephisto (E3 & E4 labels)

Water:

• Going to do an A/B test this go-round. Both plants will get the same nutes.
  • E1 & E3 will get store-bought RO water. I verified this stuff is 0 PPM with my cheapie TDS meter.
  • E2 & E4 will get our well water. I am bypassing softener. We're around 260PPM lately; can fluctuate as high as 400.
• All water will be PH'ed to 6.2-6.5 and given the same dosage of Prescription Blend nutes.

Strategy:

My intent behind the A/B test is to see if my well water was the root cause of my issues last grow. I observed, with multiple plants, similar splotches of necrosis that eventually led to leaves dying off en mass. I suspect that an excess of something in my water might've been leading to a lockout of some nutes.

There were a lot of variables in my previous grow: Questionable soil (OF), me screwing around with lights a lot (Some signs of burn), and not keeping the humidifier topped off proactively enough to maintain good VPD, etc. I have all of those under control this grow and am looking forward to seeing if I can narrow this down.

If both groups improve, I can stop blaming my water and accept that the previous issues were soil + environment. If one of the groups improve, I'm betting it will be the RO group -- and I can invest in a home RO setup so I can stop carting this stuff in 5 gal at a time.


Week 1

Minimal updates for today. Really just wanted to kick this thread off and share the details of what I'm doing. The girls are 8 days old today and doing well. 4 of 4 successfully germinated just by throwing them in some wet soil and leaving them in the dark for a couple days. I didn't bother with the heat mat this time since it's staying around 72 degrees in there in the dark.

Both Mephistos took an extra day to sprout, but they are catching up nicely. Color looks good. I am going to go ahead and mix up their new pots today; but will probably wait a couple more days before I transplant. Light remains dimmed fully and around 28" above. Stretching is minimal. I'm going to be extremely cautious with light this time, as I'm not positive my previous issues weren't at least partially light burn.

Thanks for reading!

Looking good!

 

[Green Hornet]

Nice Bruce Banner in an auto you have my attention.

 

[olegren]

Today is day 10. Weekly average temp is 77.3 and average humidity is 71.1%.

Trying to stay on top of humidifier refills. When this one goes, I will buy one with a higher capacity. This thing goes through 1 gal distilled water in about 2 days.

Took some time over the weekend to prep their final 3 gal smart pots: More HF hand mixed with perilite. I went ahead and watered each with about 1/4 gal well water treated with some myco to get the good stuff going.

Tempted as I am, I will let them go a few more days before getting them out of the solo cups. I'll probably trim the bottoms out tonight so that the actual 'transplant' process is as simple as cutting the sides and peeling out the plastic.

I fed them their first dose of nutes today. Store-bought RO water with 1ml each of Core A & B. PHed to 6.5. I had to use a pinch of baking soda to get back in range. Going to get some more stable PH up & down from local store today. PPM is 144.

 

[olegren]

A few updates for today. I hemmed and hawed about transplanting. Wanted to do it yesterday; then decided they weren't ready. Today I had almost decided the same; but upon pulling the cups up and inspecting, I was excited to see roots coming out all over the place. They weren't root bound, but it was definitely time. This was substantially better root growth than I have observed in previous grows. Not sure if it's the water or subtler changes in my process. (I think it's the water) Either way --

So I went ahead and transplanted. Gave each about 50ml water to soak them through, waited about 20 minutes, sprinkled holes with myco, and then transplanted with a quick flip and some caution.

This went pretty well; although both my Mephistos (E3 & E4) were lanky before. After they were pretty much laying on their sides. I didn't want to do it, but rather than propping up I decided to re-bury. Carefully shook soil from roots, dug deeper holes, and planted a bit of their stems. I expect this will stunt them a day or two, but I don't think I had much of a choice. Next time I think I might go straight to final pots so I can skip this phase altogether.

Before & after photos attached. Having seen that root growth, I am stoked to see what happens in the next couple weeks. Growth seems markedly better than my previous runs.

 

[olegren]

Today is Day 19, so we are nearing the end of week 3.

I am encouraged to see all four ladies seem to be doing well. In retrospect, 4 plants was a bad idea for this little 2x4 tent. I really didn't think all 4 would make it this far, and having two of everything has made it easier to experiment a little.

Lights
Both Mephisto girls are a little smaller, but this is not a huge surprise. Bruce stretched early.

I wanted to take it easy with lights this time to not risk burning, so I was incrementing 1-2K lux/day (starting around 10K and working my way up to the current 24K). I have been at 24K for a couple days. I think this was part of why everyone stretched so much, and that transplant last week definitely set the Mephisto ladies back a couple days.

This is 352ppfd per vendor specs, so I probably won't take it much further until we get into flower.

Feeding
I started feeding this week. Week 1 veg nutes (full dose - after starting with half seedling doses last week and observing a few hints of deficiency across the board) from Prescription Blend. I am resisting the urge to add cal mag. I'll let them tell me if they need it, but there's some in the mix already.

The nutes seem to have visibly perked everyone up. Color seems better, and stems are fattening up a bit. I gave them 16oz. each Tuesday; and another 16oz. each today.

Environment
Averages for this week are 78.5F and 65.3% RH. Thanks to @Olderfart I haven't had to worry about humidity near as much (Hung a towel dipped in water near passive intake), so I'm running exhaust 24/7 now as well. Humidifier is barely running. My environment on the whole is much more stable this grow.

Training
I decided to get experimental and top the healthier looking Bruce (E1). She took it well; although I noticed pistils the very next day. I'm only seeing them on the topped node; so hoping this didn't accelerate anything. I think I see a hint of them forming on the other Bruce auto; who started LST today. .Just bent her sideways to expose a few lower nodes - Nothing complicated.

Leaving Mephistos alone. If they blow up in the next few days, I'll probably start LST for them. I will give straight water if they need any more this week; then do another round of Rx Blend next week per their schedule.

 

[Olderfart]

Hey @olegren, glad to hear that the towel did the job. Your environment sounds spot on now, there is certainly no need for more humidity. You will actually need to back off a bit as you head into flower and the plants get bigger. Those ladies look happy!

You may have to decide to off-load one of the girls. That 2x4 is going to get a bit tough to manage otherwise. Got a friend with space?

 

[olegren]

Hey @olegren, glad to hear that the towel did the job. Your environment sounds spot on now, there is certainly no need for more humidity. You will actually need to back off a bit as you head into flower and the plants get bigger. Those ladies look happy!

You may have to decide to off-load one of the girls. That 2x4 is going to get a bit tough to manage otherwise. Got a friend with space?

Thanks! I have been lowering the threshhold on my humidifier daily. Right now it's set at 45 and seems to kick on about once an hour for a couple minutes. Not bad at all and much more sustainable. I hope you don't mind a couple more questions as I fine-tune! Do you change your towel out on any time interval? It occurred to me that the thing might encourage mold growth, but I'm not really sure. Once the tray empties, I'm going to move things around a bit so that only one passive intake is open -- and the towel will be in front of it. Still got a fan on it, but it's on the other side of the tent and probably not doing a whole lot of good so far as pushing moisture out of the towel goes.

I think you are right about space. TBH I hope they get that big after all their predecessors were stunted and tiny. I'm in an un-woke part of the world, so unfortunately offloading one is not an option. If nothing else, I think I might stick one of the Bruces outside a few hours a day to see how it acclimates; and potentially move it altogether if that doesn't kill it.

 

[Olderfart]

Thanks! I have been lowering the threshhold on my humidifier daily. Right now it's set at 45 and seems to kick on about once an hour for a couple minutes. Not bad at all and much more sustainable. I hope you don't mind a couple more questions as I fine-tune! Do you change your towel out on any time interval? It occurred to me that the thing might encourage mold growth, but I'm not really sure. Once the tray empties, I'm going to move things around a bit so that only one passive intake is open -- and the towel will be in front of it. Still got a fan on it, but it's on the other side of the tent and probably not doing a whole lot of good so far as pushing moisture out of the towel goes.

I think you are right about space. TBH I hope they get that big after all their predecessors were stunted and tiny. I'm in an un-woke part of the world, so unfortunately offloading one is not an option. If nothing else, I think I might stick one of the Bruces outside a few hours a day to see how it acclimates; and potentially move it altogether if that doesn't kill it.

I don't mind questions at all, happy to help if I can - I have certainly received lots of help from more experienced peeps on here, and love to pass the info along when possible. Anyway, I didn't change the towel when I used it, and never had any mould either on the towel or the bud. The complete lack of mould on the bud was a pleasant result after my summer grow.

I can't recall how long I used the towel before the plants took over, but I likely used it for at least a few weeks without problems. If you need to keep it going for longer, you could easily just swap out the towel for a fresh one. As far as mould on the buds is concerned, as long as you keep the RH somewhere on the dry side of the good VPD range, and keep air moving through the canopy, you should have zero issues.

Trying one of the Banners outdoors sounds like a good solution to the space problem. If you can, you might think about a poly roof to keep the rain off it. I still ended up with mould last summer in spite of the roof, but I also ended up with some nice bud. I have one plant down there at the moment, this time with a fan moving air through it, but I will be shocked if I avoid mould this time - we are setting records here for cold and wet this summer. I have never seen an August like this. The better half is starting to talk about a move south...

Good luck with the grow, you are doing great so far.

 

[olegren]

Tomorrow will end week 4, so this is Day 27.

Everybody seems to be doing well. Comparing this week's photos with last week's, I am pretty pleased with progress. I noticed some more of those strange rust/burn spots early on (right after my last update) and made a quick detour to the infirmary. Still not entirely sure what root cause of those was, but I am relieved that it wasn't the same issue I saw in previous grows. It hasn't spread, and the plants seem quite happy.

Top left: E1 (Bruce Banner), Top Right E3 (Forum Stomper x CDLC), Bottom left: E4 (Forum Stomper x CDLC), Bottom right: E2 (Bruce Banner)

Lights & Environment
Everyone's getting about 382ppfd right now. I noticed both Mephisto crosses started to do the taco a little bit at 400, so I will leave it alone here for now. I was alternating between lowering my QB and raising the dimmer so as to see how well my new humidifier + exhaust scheme would affect conditions. So far it's still pretty good.

Averages for the last week were 78.5F and 58.0% RH. I actually took my humidifier out of the tent altogether last night. I originally intended to run it in my lung room, but I figured I'd see how things were without it. Seems to have leveled out around 53% RH with my soaking towel hanging in front of passive intake. I have to refill the tray once every other day or so; although that might increase now that humidifier is out of the mix. I've been able to ramp exhaust up substantially and maintain. This is excellent. (I owe @Olderfart many beers)

Moved the tent around a bit today in order to get the towel in front of my passive intake. My light configuration is not ideal for a 2x4, but I'm making it work. Looking into a separate veg light for future grows since this QB is 3K. It's working for now - I just think I could do better in veg now that my other glaring issues are resolved.

Feeding
I'm on week 2 of Rx Blend and following their dosage recommendation. If I had it to do over, I would've followed everyone's advice and started at half. I had a few scares, and some of the tips are burnt. But I promptly backed off and started interspersing plain old RO water in between feedings. I'll give them some more tomorrow, and then I'll start the Rx Blend week 3 regimen at half dose to make sure we don't overdo it.

Training
Having two of everything leaves me feeling a bit like a kid in a candy store. I don't have that paranoia about irreparably destroying anything, and it's cool to be able to see two distinct approaches and how they affect each strain. I topped E1 last week, and it looks like a success. She halted a day or two, showed some preflowers, and then the growth was pretty explosive. This is the first time I've seen firsthand what topping does. It was obvious this thing was going to get huge, so I started some LST on her as well to try and keep her from tripling the others' height. (She was already double easy) I did damage one stem. Had a few drinks and started tinkering. Should've known better. Anyway, the stem is not broken, and the buds are still growing -- so going to leave her alone.

Otherwise just some light LST for most of the others. I decided to leave E4 alone. Her leaves are thick and bushy, and she's still only about 7" tall. Will be interested to compare yields from her and her LST'd sister when all is said and done.

Thanks again for reading -- and sharing your wisdom with me. I would have given up on this hobby a couple grows ago if not for so many kind people willing to share.