New Grower Flushing Formula - Discussion.

[Invincible]

its a very interesting topic to be honest. I did think giving it more chemicals to flush out other chemical doesn't make sense. But i dont understand how it works and the science behind it. I will to try canna flush but Im not 100 percent,?

 

[Waira]

:smoking: Bunny- I double checked with one our premier organic grower/farmers about the removing of ionic nutrients from the plant tissue via the roots, using a "flushing formula"... and that's not what happens,... Roots do release exudates (organic molecules like: sugars, vitamins, amino acids, long chain carbohydrates, enzymes and lysates; H and bicarb ions from the cation/anion exchange metabolism) into the soil, which feeds bacteria and fungi and consequently feeds the plants.... primary, secondary, and micro' cation nutes are not released by living cells,... and no flushing solution forces these out of the plant tissues, despite what the product labels say,...the cellular absorption and transport mechanisms simply don't work this way... What these products do is help strip loose the particle bound cations, freeing them to be flushed away.... by removing the excess nute's from the soil, the plant is forced to scavenge from within, using up stored/surplus nute's.... hence the fans going yellow, red, etc. before they drop off as they reach the end...

Here's an example of product propaganda that's pure bogus science: "Humboldt Nutrients Royal Flush supercharges the flushing process, binding together undesirable salts and heavy minerals. Royal Flush then strips these larger particles out of your plant, leaving behind sugars and strong flavors. Your plant is composed of water, sugars and salts. If you flush out the salts and dry out the water, you're left with delicious and aromatic sugars, and sugars rule the natural world."

..This gotta be the biggest load of BS I've seen to date! None of this happens inside the plant, much less is magically transported to the roots and expelled into the soil,... ....The last two sentences are so laughably wrong, it's should be illegal to label a product with this crap... Ask anybody that has overdone the carb' sourcing by harvest time, and see what they say about "sugary flavor" -- you know how nasty burned sugar smells/tastes like? Also, the terpenes are all in the trich' heads, along with the cannabinoids... not exactly connected with the roots, right? Honestly, the marketing crap some of these companies come up with,...
...hope this was enlightening Bunny,...please pardon the foaming rant there!... Cheers to you and the fine ladies you have going right now!

 

[forestly]

This is really interesting discussion, i wonder what do the "flushing solution" provided by the nute companies really do then. Something they do sell us, but since they dont describe what is in that bottle or how their "system" works, it is hard to elaborate have they really done somthing different or its just snake oil talk.

I would like to think that there is some vendors/producers out there that have something that works. Hopefully, not all of them sell bullshit.

 

[Pal23]

Like myself, the majority of growers I've connected with use just water to flush with great success, however that isn't to say there are no flushing nutes that work, I've not experimented with them so can't be sure. Someone should do a comparison maybe? 2 plants, flush one with flush solution and the other with just water then report back on the taste/smoke..any volunteers?! I might do it at the end of my photo run but it won't be for a while yet..I don't think it's any secret that nute companies like to package up certain nutes purely for a profit but as forestly said, I'd like to think there are at least a handful of companies that have integrity also in the bottle since there are so many different flushing nutes available!

p.s I definitely wouldn't use any flushing solution if it were an organic grow - seems counter productive

 

[blue]

I think the biggest confusion is from the word flushing that has 2 meanings.

From reading wairas (more botanical) overview, the flushing forumular does what it is supposed to do. Helps rid salts from the medium. (during a flush)

What these products do is help strip loose the particle bound cations, freeing them to be flushed away....

I was also on at canna last night - they use their wording very carefully and with wairas description above you'll see where the confusion comes in with "ridding the plants of excess nute" .... but in actuality, the plant is using them - not expelling them somehow. And the medium is being stripped.

Here's the canna quote

CANNA FLUSH is a product to clean substrates and plants from any excess nutrients. This is necessary, because excess nutrients can have a bad influence your next growth cycle. They could lead to over-fertilisation or malnutrition, for example.

here's the website wording

Why should you use CANNA FLUSH?

• When used just before harvest it makes sure the plant gets rid of all excess, which will lead to a clean and tasteful harvest.
• CANNA FLUSH effectively cleans the substrate without killing any useful bacteria or beneficial fungi, as can be the case when you use reverse osmosis or de-mineralised water.
• It can be used on all substrates.
• CANNA FLUSH is recyclable.

But interesting - here's the usage - and the Intersting bits are the first and third - The first describes what we call a flush (to correct mid grow problems) and the third describes what we would call a "cleanse" but is not apporpriate at all to what we do due to it not being an annual plant and also "continue through harvest on a normal feeding schedule" - isn't what we want for a "cleanse".

Flushing excess nutrients from drainable substrates
Soil or Soil-less mixes:

• Dilute 20 ml concentrate per 10 litre of water (1:500) until you have drain
• Water plants once with plain tap water according to normal watering frequency until you have drain
• Then resume normal feeding schedule

Hydroponics (open systems):

• Administer the diluted FLUSH (40ml per 10 litre water, which is 1:250) the last feed of the day until there is 10-20% drain
• Water plants once with plain tap water until you have drain
• Start administering according to normal feeding schedule (with 10-20% drain) the following day

Before harvest (annual crops only)

• Start one to two weeks before harvest and apply at above rates and in the above fashion once a week.
• Continue through harvest on a normal feeding schedule.

Re-using inert substrates
CANNA FLUSH is ideal for cleaning inert substrates (like clay pebbles). Add diluted CANNA FLUSH (40ml/10 litre tap water). Soak for 24 hours then rinse with same amount of tap water. Repeat if necessary.

Storage, health & safety and other directions

• Shake bottle well before use
• Store closed in a dark and frost-proof place
• Keep out of reach of children

Warranty / Guarantee
CANNA only works with high graded ingredients, which are immediately and completely available for the plant. The bottle is made of polyethylene (PVC and cadmium free), a recyclable plastic.

Phew - Sorry for the wall of text. Canna are helpful folk though!

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[Pal23]

@blue What I take from that info is that it's probably a good idea to use the flushing solution if you had a super soil for example and planned on re using it, or re using your clay pebbles in hydro..but as far as cleansing goes, as we like to call it, at the end of a plants life cycle, water is proven to do the job - removes excess salts and nutes in the medium which causes the plant to cannibalise any nutrients stored in it's leaves, job done! Like I said earlier a comparison would be great so I'll make sure I do it at the end of my new grow, even if it just settles the decision for me

 

[blue]

@Pal23 - You are brave! After whats been said, i personally wouldn't risk half of my harvest on an experiment. My only concern is that it would taste bad. I wonder what it smells like?

 

[Invincible]

I think to sum it all up ... just flush with plain tap water? 10 days .... but do you feed from bottom of plant or from top of soil?

 

[blue]

@Invincible - Water slowly from the top of the pot until it runs out of the bottom. Get a nice 10% run off with every watering and it should keep the medium pretty clean anyway (dont let the pots sit in the run off water and remove the run off water if the humidity is high during flowering (not usually a problem during veg))

 

[Pal23]

@Pal23 - You are brave! After whats been said, i personally wouldn't risk half of my harvest on an experiment. My only concern is that it would taste bad. I wonder what it smells like?

Aha brave or stupid Blue?! Honestly with hydro I don't think it will be so bad..it's my organic grows where I wouldn't want to risk it because it's all about the tastes and terpene profiles..someone on site must have tried a flushing solution surely?!