Small population photo-to-auto breeding?

[Pop’n Smokz]

Those babies are beautiful nice structure ,nice frost ,and most of all I like the consistency in the Nympho very nice work you show.. You keep up the good work and I will continue to Fly HIgh!!!

 

[OutofAfrica]

First off , interesting thread. You can tell you have put a lot of thought into your breeding plan.
Your main hurdle is plant count but you have options as others have posted.
I've been pollen chucking for a while but prefer a ear bud instead of a paintbrush, each to there own .
I'm sure you could find somewhere to hide a little polytunnel outdoors which can hold another 12-16 plants .

It's outdoor and you have to deal with the elements but they grow all the same for breeding project.
That tunnel is at lat55N , I don't pull oz off plants just seeds . You can fit a few 3gallon buckets in there.

Wildlife on weed

All her babies in there den above . At least they keep the other critter in check .

 

[mohawk warrior]

More of a selection is always good, because you never really know what the genetic shuffle can bring out or even the environment.
In all experiments larger study group equals better, more accurate results.
Another not talked about thing with the selfed plants is depending on the parents you could be setting yourself up for the herm because you’re basically copying that genetic Alias which could potentially latch to something hidden. I also believe from what I read you can cancel this out potentially with making a duplicate of the pattern and rewriting it into the plants genetic structure,
Thus helping you eliminate rouge self preservation genes. But inbreed too much and you risk the chance of running your good genetics out. The inbreeding depression..
Good old recessives.
But what do I know


Cool thread

 

[parsing_trees]

Another not talked about thing with the selfed plants is depending on the parents you could be setting yourself up for the herm because you’re basically copying that genetic Alias which could potentially latch to something hidden. I also believe from what I read you can cancel this out potentially with making a duplicate of the pattern and rewriting it into the plants genetic structure,

I don't think selfing is involved here. My hypothetical plan is to pop a pack of photoperiod seeds, pollinate most of the females with pollen from a male auto of a complementary strain, then line breed those for a couple generations to re-stabilize the auto trait but end up with something with as many of the traits I like from the photoperiod as I can. In each generation, I would collect pollen from at least one male, hand-pollinate individual lower branches on each female plant that isn't an obvious reject (noting which branch came from which male, and keeping seeds separate when harvested), but keep the rest of the plants unseeded. I'd try the flower from all the pollinated plants (hard work ) and decide which seeds to use in further generations. If there isn't a clear standout or lots of rejects, I'd consider doing that generation over, since that's the main way to increase the population size while sticking to a small plant count.

 

[mohawk warrior]

I don't think selfing is involved here. My hypothetical plan is to pop a pack of photoperiod seeds, pollinate most of the females with pollen from a male auto of a complementary strain, then line breed those for a couple generations to re-stabilize the auto trait but end up with something with as many of the traits I like from the photoperiod as I can. In each generation, I would collect pollen from at least one male, hand-pollinate individual lower branches on each female plant that isn't an obvious reject (noting which branch came from which male, and keeping seeds separate when harvested), but keep the rest of the plants unseeded. I'd try the flower from all the pollinated plants (hard work ) and decide which seeds to use in further generations. If there isn't a clear standout or lots of rejects, I'd consider doing that generation over, since that's the main way to increase the population size while sticking to a small plant count.

Definitely possible.
I think it was f4 or f5’s where the auto will take over for ya

 

[Fitzy]

Definitely possible.
I think it was f4 or f5’s where the auto will take over for ya

Yes by f4 it should be 99% auto I personally have bought f4s from breeders which were supposed to be auto but wernt they were semi auto but I also had similar with photos but instead there semi auto meaning switch light to 16hrs on and they started flowering I even increased light on those to 18hrs on after 7days and they continued to flower despite the light changing it just goes to show even when u think u know wat ur doing traits pop up, I honestly think we don't have a good grasp on wat will do wat or alot of breeders would have multiple cuts of supposedly the same genetics there will always be differences in phenos. I actually have pics of a blue widow I grew out 2 clones from which were planted in same soil feed the exact same and put directly next to eachother that looked totally different then the mother not to mention different to eachother and this was a dinafem seed so not a small breeder and certainly 1 that good but again I don't think we have the full story on genetics, and I think it's why u see a difference between even well bread cultivars I want to experiment with some f9 f10 seeds from Ace there 1 of the only 1s who bring them out that far that I've seen large scale. I want to see how similar or different they are in comparison to f4 f5 that I've grown

 

[mohawk warrior]

Yes by f4 it should be 99% auto I personally have bought f4s from breeders which were supposed to be auto but wernt they were semi auto but I also had similar with photos but instead there semi auto meaning switch light to 16hrs on and they started flowering I even increased light on those to 18hrs on after 7days and they continued to flower despite the light changing it just goes to show even when u think u know wat ur doing traits pop up, I honestly think we don't have a good grasp on wat will do wat or alot of breeders would have multiple cuts of supposedly the same genetics there will always be differences in phenos. I actually have pics of a blue widow I grew out 2 clones from which were planted in same soil feed the exact same and put directly next to eachother that looked totally different then the mother not to mention different to eachother and this was a dinafem seed so not a small breeder and certainly 1 that good but again I don't think we have the full story on genetics, and I think it's why u see a difference between even well bread cultivars I want to experiment with some f9 f10 seeds from Ace there 1 of the only 1s who bring them out that far that I've seen large scale. I want to see how similar or different they are in comparison to f4 f5 that I've grown

Well said and cool plan.
I’d like to see the background on some of those f10s I’m gonna poke around ace for a second.
Also you never know what will show when you put em outside, most are indoor projects of on another part of the planet...
Or hybrids

 

[DIRT]

Yes by f4 it should be 99% auto

If you were to cross a male and female showing the auto trait in the F2 you would have 99% autoflowering in the F3 seed stock.

Personally, I would suggest making a shit load of F2's when creating a new auto from scratch.That way you can always go back to the drawing board and start over if things start heading in the wrong direction or if you decide to head in a new one.

 

[Fitzy]

If you were to cross a male and female showing the auto trait in the F2 you would have 99% autoflowering in the F3 seed stock.

Personally, I would suggest making a shit load of F2's when creating a new auto from scratch.That way you can always go back to the drawing board and start over if things start heading in the wrong direction or if you decide to head in a new one.

That's mostly true but recessive traits are wat kills u doing that this is why you can still get photo dependent plants from breeders like rocbud mephisto ect I've had it happen personally with mephisto and a good freind with rockbud

 

[DIRT]

That's mostly true but recessive traits are wat kills u doing that this is why you can still get photo dependent plants from breeders like rocbud mephisto ect I've had it happen personally with mephisto and a good freind with rockbud

That maybe true...but at what ratio 1in1000?

I usually pop 100 seeds of one particular strain and filial generation as a benchmark when I'm breeding to take a line further, And I personally have yet to see a photoperiod plant in my F3 photo x auto projects or in successive generations, sometimes growing as many as 300 F3's of one particular line....but that's just my own personal firsthand experience up to this point in time.

I know its possible for a photo to show up in the F3, I just haven't seen it myself when using two day neutral F2 plants to make those F3 seeds.

The same thing could also be said about fem seed be it photo or auto...
You might still find a small number of males in large populations of what should be 100% feminised seed.

I guess It all boils down to selection and luck, unless you have lab access and can tinker with genetic markers..it mostly depends on luck,imo.

You can always predict using a punnett square...but mother nature can always take you for a ride in a different direction.

breeding is like a box of chocolates, ya never know what your gonna get.

But again I do agree with you mostly.

Godspeed F4 after some pre-emptive culling.