New Grower Second Grow. Grape Muerto, LED, Soil, Organic

[MediJane]

And the Grape Muerto is down! Not much in terms of yield but she is so gooey, sticky and stinky! She is in paper bags now, probably ready to jar in a couple of days. Smoke report to follow!

 

[MediJane]

And I lost it all to mold. Damn!

 

[Waira]

Gaahhhh!! aaaw, maaaaaan,... Janie, that really really sucks! I hate hearing about this misfortune more than any other, save theft! Can you tell me specifics about your drying conditions? Let's try to pin down what happened, so it never does again!...( did you check out the Drying and Curing thread?)..... I see you started in paper bags, which is fine under some conditions, but not all...There's a lot of back and forth about the best way to dry/cure, but your environmental conditions are the first determining factor,... My theory is, for paper bags, is if you live in warm, low RH conditions, they can provide an RH buffer of sorts, trapping some RH to slow things down, and not allow buds to dry too fast,... in high RH (60%+), warm or cool, paper bags trap too much moist air, even if left partly open; gentle air movement is very important... My experience with one plant harvested during an odd Fall storm here, making for warm, moist conditions,...mesh multi-tiered dry rack, 65+ RH even in the house (no AC), 2 days and the buds hardly dried at all, then I started seeing odd discoloring in some leaves, a dark, wet look, and that's a bad sign! I had to toss them into the frost-free freezer and try that method for drying,...saved that plant, but not the best results, IMO... Anyway, let me know about your conditions, etc.,.... ...wish you were close enough to share! :smoking:

 

[Bunny]

Moulds a killer, had some attack my year old TD even though I thought it was a little over dry! You have to keep checking and burping and break down those buds. Luckily I picked out the mould and Vaped it before it took hold completely. Nothing worse when you feel you have it all done!

 

[MediJane]

Waira, I love you! Thank you for your genuine concern! Seriously. AFN Fam are the BEST!

Drying conditions were so, so difficult! I live in Texas and, as you probably saw on the news, we had a bit of rain last month. Actually, it started about eight days before harvest. So, the final few days of the grow, the tent RH was 95%. I managed to get it to 80% using a dehumidifier, but it was just ridiculous.

I made mistakes as well, for sure! Here is what I did...

I trimmed the fan leaves and most of the sugar leaves. Chopped the buds off the stalk(s). Layed them in a single row (there wasn't much) on the bottom of a paper grocery bag (same one I used for first harvest), and topped with shredded brown paper. I folded the bag halfway but did not clamp it shut. After one day I remembered that I needed to break up the cola and large buds and I did. I thought so anyway.

I tried leaving the bag inside my house but that wonderful aroma was just too strong, so I had to put it back in the tent in the (humid) garage. I ran the dehumidifier but only managed to get the tent RH to about 77%, maybe. I opened the bag once a day and shook it a little. Then I folded it again and left it there, in the dark with two desk fans and my extraction fan going.

Four days later, I brought it inside and trimmed the last of the sugar leaves. Then I tossed it in a jar. I kept forgetting to burp the jar, so I probably only did that twice a day for the first two days, the once a day for the next four or five days.

The bud smelled and tasted amazing at this point, so I thought all was good. I never went more than 24 hours before burping the jar, but the bud was still too wet, I presume. One day I saw some white stuff on a bud I was about to vape, so I smelled it and it smelled like a hospital. Weird! I got out my loupe to examined it - and it had white, cobweb-looking stuff on some parts. I trimmed those parts off, broke the buds into tiny little things, left the rest in the open air for a few hours, then tossed it all back in the jar

The next day I look and smell again, more mold. So I tossed it all.

OMG moldy weed smells so bad! As much as I wanted, needed this harvest...there is no way I would smoke or otherwise knowingly ingest mold, so I flushed it all ;( . So sad! Today I went for my ultra-premium reserve (about 2 grams left) of Think Different. It was moldy too. Tossed it!

And to top it all off... I can't start another grow until September (unless I figure out some way to stealth it inside my house, lol), and my town is all over the news right now about a pool party incident. So, I am one grouchy gal!

Okay (deep breath). Thank you! Thanks for caring, thanks for listening (reading) and thanks for any advice so I don't have to deal with this again!

Much love,

Jane

Gaahhhh!! aaaw, maaaaaan,... Janie, that really really sucks! I hate hearing about this misfortune more than any other, save theft! Can you tell me specifics about your drying conditions? Let's try to pin down what happened, so it never does again!...( did you check out the Drying and Curing thread?)..... I see you started in paper bags, which is fine under some conditions, but not all...There's a lot of back and forth about the best way to dry/cure, but your environmental conditions are the first determining factor,... My theory is, for paper bags, is if you live in warm, low RH conditions, they can provide an RH buffer of sorts, trapping some RH to slow things down, and not allow buds to dry too fast,... in high RH (60%+), warm or cool, paper bags trap too much moist air, even if left partly open; gentle air movement is very important... My experience with one plant harvested during an odd Fall storm here, making for warm, moist conditions,...mesh multi-tiered dry rack, 65+ RH even in the house (no AC), 2 days and the buds hardly dried at all, then I started seeing odd discoloring in some leaves, a dark, wet look, and that's a bad sign! I had to toss them into the frost-free freezer and try that method for drying,...saved that plant, but not the best results, IMO... Anyway, let me know about your conditions, etc.,.... ...wish you were close enough to share! :smoking:

 

[MediJane]

Bunny, you are so right! I thought my TD was over-dry too and damn.... worst feeling in the world to watch that swirl down the loo! I thought about just trimming off the white stuff and keeping the rest but I couldn't get the view and smell of the mold out of my head...

Moulds a killer, had some attack my year old TD even though I thought it was a little over dry! You have to keep checking and burping and break down those buds. Luckily I picked out the mould and Vaped it before it took hold completely. Nothing worse when you feel you have it all done!

 

[DABaracuss]

Well take a look at the drying and cureing area maybe you can get some ideas on how to dry net time..to grow and have problems then get a small yield then loose it to mold lol some bad luck..but you seem like a trooper..keep ya head up and you will find your lungs full of smoke...you got a taste of the good fresh and I bet you cant wait..cant half step ya grow..Looks like you have all you may need for your net grow to be the bomb.

 

[Waira]

....ahhh, shucks Janie,... Thank you, luvie!
Mmmm, I know you feel like this- ... but given what you told me, to have made it work, you'd spend a forune on AC, and even then, the aroma wasn't "house approved",... Clearly, the mini dehum'er was overwhelmed too! Indeed, I did see the batshit cray-cray weather y'all were having down there (nephew lives in Houston)-- couldn't have come at a worse time! ... *sigh*.... wish I'da known, I would have looked up member Tokaite who's dialed in the freezer method nicely, so he says,..still will, if I can find him-- he loves the results of freeze drying!... Otherwise, here's the good and bad about what you did, beyond just the too warm/humid conditions:
--good: breaking the nugg's down to smaller sizes, more surface area exposed, and "breathing",...bad: bagging them, and (worse) burying them under paper shreds, and closing it off even partly; this traps the humidity, which is even higher in the bag,... BUT even if you had put them in an open mesh dry rack, the T and RH were sooo off the mark, you still likely would have had mold issues,... it's amazing just how profound a difference that a 10-15% rise RH can make!... that week what I saw between 55%RH and near 70% was night and day...
Buds can hold moisture at their cores pretty well, hence all the rotating and burping, etc.,... I'm thinking yours never even got dry enough to jar,...At that point, you should have some snap to the stems; the jars initially help to really even things out, and make buds ready for proper cure time (more chemistry changes, especially with the terp's, but potency usually increases as well some)...My AZ buddy has your opposite problem-- his buds get almost crispy on the outside, but the stems still flex readily! Too fast, and the chlorophyll doesn't break down, making for harsh and "green" tasting buds.. That's where the bags come in, to trap some moisture, and buffer it's release... Ideally, around 70F and 50% RH is what you want; on my mesh rack it takes about 5 days to get jar ready, (maybe 1 or so into bags on fatter buds, to even things out some), giving the buds time to dry evenly, and most important, undergo the all important breakdown chemistry changes that happen (chlorophyll, carbs, etc.), making for smooth flavorful smoke,... Terpenes are doing things too during this time, and keeping Temps below 75F helps prevent excessive volatilization losses,... Look up that dry/cure thread here, for lots of good details and such! ..... Big picture, you never had a chance my friend, not in those conditions! Weeeelll, now ya know! ... I'd love to see you work something out for an in-house run, even a small one with a couple gals! There are some strains that aren't that stinky during growth... I forget, what lights are you using? I just picked up my first LED, from Mars-Hydro, a 96x3w Reflector model, for a very reasonable price... lots of fine grows here using them, so we know they're worthy! LED's run so cool, it's perfect for other heat challenged folks,... point is, you may not even need a full tent.. I'm thinking the supplemental light set-up I have might work well enough for a full ID grow,..(I'm OD growing mainly, just boosting light hours at night to 20/4)..here's my ghetto tent!

This is all Home Depot available: 4x2 styro' insulation panels, foiled on one side; bubble wrap type duct insulation, 2x10, then 4x10 when they're taller! No fans, no ducting, but then, my weather here is very conducive for such a simple set-up (coastal central CA) ..plants are upper 70's, 50-60% RH,... when they're bigger and spread out more, I'll cut-to-fit the wrap stuff, so not roll at the end,... Anyway, there's a cheap idea for pondering,...best of all, such a set-up could be broken down and stashed in a couple minutes! The girls, will need creative thinking... ...... here's something lovely for you to enjoy, even if you can't smoke it! Orchid cactus, cousins to the Christmas cactus-- eye singing color baby!! ...love back at'cha Janie,....

>> Bunny ... thank you for chiming in, and commiserating!

 

[MediJane]

DAb,

It is a complete bummer, but live and learn! I am grateful that I'm traveling to Denver soon, that's for sure! And yes, I have a great set-up for when I resume in the fall!

Well take a look at the drying and cureing area maybe you can get some ideas on how to dry net time..to grow and have problems then get a small yield then loose it to mold lol some bad luck..but you seem like a trooper..keep ya head up and you will find your lungs full of smoke...you got a taste of the good fresh and I bet you cant wait..cant half step ya grow..Looks like you have all you may need for your net grow to be the bomb.

 

[MediJane]

Waria,
You just saved me hours of research - explaining the dry and cure! . Thank you, thank you! I really enjoy learning all the science behind this little plant that I love!

Yes the timing of this was just so bad. There was nowhere to go! It rained for days and days....It is often very humid here so I need to look up the freeze dry for sure! You are so right about the buds not being dry enough to jar. I suspected as much when I jarred it. Grrrrr.

I have been thinking about getting a stealthy little inside setup going. In fact, I already have everything you have in your picture! (I just can't do it though. Too risky with teenagers around all day). When I started my first grow (January 2015) I lined a cardboard wardrobe box with the radiant barrier material, cut in holes for the fans & electric, and cut a door with a little window, lol! What's really funny is...that grow - in my little ghetto set up and freezing temperatures and 20% RH on a good day - was way better than the one I did with my fancy new setup and perfect temperatures! Ha! How does that happen? I got a nice tent, added a 6" intake fan pumpingin fresh air and I upgraded to the Mars-Hydro 96X3 (from the old stle 300w). All that and I end up with maybe 40 grams (that I had to flush down the toilet), a hermie, two seeds that wouldn't germ.

Oh well, live and learn! I'm excited for September to come and I have everything I need! Including a whole bunch of Mephisto seeds that I'm rather excited about. And I found a hydro shop that is not too far away so I can get good soils, nutrients, etc...

The good news is that I'm going to Denver for a week in July and I will most likely go to So Cal in August. So I will survive!

How do you like your 96X3 so far? I got it about 45 - 50 days in so I really couldn't say. Is it performing well? It runs really cool doesn't it. Are you journaling a grow I can follow?

Thank for the awesome Orchid cactus pictures! Beauties!

....ahhh, shucks Janie,... Thank you, luvie!
Mmmm, I know you feel like this- ... but given what you told me, to have made it work, you'd spend a forune on AC, and even then, the aroma wasn't "house approved",... Clearly, the mini dehum'er was overwhelmed too! Indeed, I did see the batshit cray-cray weather y'all were having down there (nephew lives in Houston)-- couldn't have come at a worse time! ... *sigh*.... wish I'da known, I would have looked up member Tokaite who's dialed in the freezer method nicely, so he says,..still will, if I can find him-- he loves the results of freeze drying!... Otherwise, here's the good and bad about what you did, beyond just the too warm/humid conditions:
--good: breaking the nugg's down to smaller sizes, more surface area exposed, and "breathing",...bad: bagging them, and (worse) burying them under paper shreds, and closing it off even partly; this traps the humidity, which is even higher in the bag,... BUT even if you had put them in an open mesh dry rack, the T and RH were sooo off the mark, you still likely would have had mold issues,... it's amazing just how profound a difference that a 10-15% rise RH can make!... that week what I saw between 55%RH and near 70% was night and day...
Buds can hold moisture at their cores pretty well, hence all the rotating and burping, etc.,... I'm thinking yours never even got dry enough to jar,...At that point, you should have some snap to the stems; the jars initially help to really even things out, and make buds ready for proper cure time (more chemistry changes, especially with the terp's, but potency usually increases as well some)...My AZ buddy has your opposite problem-- his buds get almost crispy on the outside, but the stems still flex readily! Too fast, and the chlorophyll doesn't break down, making for harsh and "green" tasting buds.. That's where the bags come in, to trap some moisture, and buffer it's release... Ideally, around 70F and 50% RH is what you want; on my mesh rack it takes about 5 days to get jar ready, (maybe 1 or so into bags on fatter buds, to even things out some), giving the buds time to dry evenly, and most important, undergo the all important breakdown chemistry changes that happen (chlorophyll, carbs, etc.), making for smooth flavorful smoke,... Terpenes are doing things too during this time, and keeping Temps below 75F helps prevent excessive volatilization losses,... Look up that dry/cure thread here, for lots of good details and such! ..... Big picture, you never had a chance my friend, not in those conditions! Weeeelll, now ya know! ... I'd love to see you work something out for an in-house run, even a small one with a couple gals! There are some strains that aren't that stinky during growth... I forget, what lights are you using? I just picked up my first LED, from Mars-Hydro, a 96x3w Reflector model, for a very reasonable price... lots of fine grows here using them, so we know they're worthy! LED's run so cool, it's perfect for other heat challenged folks,... point is, you may not even need a full tent.. I'm thinking the supplemental light set-up I have might work well enough for a full ID grow,..(I'm OD growing mainly, just boosting light hours at night to 20/4)..here's my ghetto tent! View attachment 458335
This is all Home Depot available: 4x2 styro' insulation panels, foiled on one side; bubble wrap type duct insulation, 2x10, then 4x10 when they're taller! No fans, no ducting, but then, my weather here is very conducive for such a simple set-up (coastal central CA) ..plants are upper 70's, 50-60% RH,... when they're bigger and spread out more, I'll cut-to-fit the wrap stuff, so not roll at the end,... Anyway, there's a cheap idea for pondering,...best of all, such a set-up could be broken down and stashed in a couple minutes! The girls, will need creative thinking... ...... here's something lovely for you to enjoy, even if you can't smoke it! Orchid cactus, cousins to the Christmas cactus-- eye singing color baby!! ...love back at'cha Janie,....View attachment 458347

View attachment 458349 View attachment 458348

>> Bunny ... thank you for chiming in, and commiserating!

Waria