Grow Mediums Peat vs Coco

[throxic]

1) How would you recommend / what do you do (if anything) to 'condition' peat before a grow?

Peat has the same or higher CEC than coco, but I've never seen or heard anything about needing to (pre)buffer at the start of a grow. You couldn't soak peat the same as coco, but does anyone flush / oversaturate / run-thru with feed beforehand to 'pre-load' the peat at all?

2) How would you expect the calcium / CEC / pH behavior to differ between peat and coco over the course of the grow?

Pro-mix and other peat blends normally come with perlite and limestone mixed in. IIR, I saw somewhere once on the Pro-mix website that recommend wetting a week before planting to allow the limestone (CaCO3) to begin dissolving / mineralizing for pH reasons. So, would peat blends be adding / making available more Ca during the grow vs. coco continuing to buffer out / make unavailable Ca from the feed as the grow progresses?

I made my own soil a few years ago using peat as the base and for 'conditioning' the peat, I added Garden Lime to bring up the pH as peat naturally sits at about 4pH. Garden Lime will last for about 3months - a full grow cycle.

Peat also holds onto water better than coco, so less-frequent waterings. A good thing or bad thing depending on how ya see it.

 

[Mañ'O'Green]

Growing in peat is so similar to living soil! That is the way I would recommend you grow. I has almost the same learning curve for cultural practices.

That said you should water, water, water, Fertigate to 10% run off, repeat. The strength just ramps up to fit the plants uptake and life stage similar to hydro but peat hangs on to the elements better than in other substrates That is why the water only days, you do not need to water to run off just too it. watch the plants as you may need to add or subtract a water day.

 

[Waira]

@Waira @Mañ'O'Green and others:
@Dankerson @JP1 @Mara Cachafa @throxic @Lil Dab @420autoflower - recently had a discussion re: buffering coco.

I didn't want to derail that conversation over there, but had some related questions regarding growing with peat if anyone can provide thoughts or input.

I use Pro-mix HP without additional amendments, mineral salt feed with every irrigation, and germinate directly in the pots. I typically start with a 'nursing solution' that is my veg feed at 50% strength. I try to saturate the pots a few days before planting a bean, but otherwise just drop it directly in the pot. I'm not looking to change much about that process.

1) How would you recommend / what do you do (if anything) to 'condition' peat before a grow?

Peat has the same or higher CEC than coco, but I've never seen or heard anything about needing to (pre)buffer at the start of a grow. You couldn't soak peat the same as coco, but does anyone flush / oversaturate / run-thru with feed beforehand to 'pre-load' the peat at all?

2) How would you expect the calcium / CEC / pH behavior to differ between peat and coco over the course of the grow?

Pro-mix and other peat blends normally come with perlite and limestone mixed in. IIR, I saw somewhere once on the Pro-mix website that recommend wetting a week before planting to allow the limestone (CaCO3) to begin dissolving / mineralizing for pH reasons. So, would peat blends be adding / making available more Ca during the grow vs. coco continuing to buffer out / make unavailable Ca from the feed as the grow progresses?

I'd say there's literally an apples-to-oranges comparison between peat and coco... Coco is far far more bitchy and high maintenance mainly due to it's peculiar CEC properties with Ca and Mg... dealing with the Ca balance (Mg to a lesser degree because Mg is a weaker charge cation at +1 vs. Ca2+; this translated into stronger binding properties and all that entails).
Also, bad batches and poor quality brands can bring seriously PITA K+ and Na+ into the gig as they are naturally high in unbuffered coco.
there's lots of info on coco out there, so if you want details, wade into the research pool -
BTW, "buffering" in coco refers to CEC buffering, not just pH....

Since you're a ProMix grower, this is all moot... You need do nothing to this RTU soilless media; peat is an entirely different animal...
Both are devoid of any significant nutrient content, by design... So yeah, for seedlings it's common for folks to dose the media with a weak nute soln. beforehand. You'd be well advised to include humic-fulvic regularly as well for a variety of benefits (good article in Reference section at the Infirmary)...

As for part2 of your question, again research coco deeper if you want a proper comparison. This is a 2-page answer in my opinion-
In peat/soiless and true soil, the Ca source lime will deplete over time usually, but a big part of that is your pH along the way, your water hardness, and what nute inputs are going in...
By choosing soilless, you automatically assign yourself the constant task of monitoring your incoming and out going pH and TDS/EC. it's the only way to keep tabs on what's going in in-pot! And that's the trick: in-pot does not = incoming soln. pH/ppm...
It'd be wise to cough up the bucks for a quality pH probe made specifically for in-pot readings (Blue Labs), these days anything else is unreliable crap IME......regular pH units are made for solutions only...
And all bulb-electrode type pH units require proper cleaning, storage (solution; NEVER use RO/DI water) and calibrations... flake on that at your our peril .... ditto for EC/TDS meters too, but not nearly as often unless abused by not rinsing them after use in very low ppm water...

 

[dankstyle J]

I use coco peat an perlite as my mix its living coco the style i pioneered I never change my medium I only remove most of the root ball an add the organic amendments I’ve bee doing this for a long time now an haven’t changed my medium in 3 years this style is unique an limited to my grows but I’m more then happy to share the results I’m extremely happy with

 

[BII]

Regarding coco: Many if not most quality coco products are now pre-buffered, with this working well for most. What regimen do you recommend for preparing pots filled with manufacturer-buffered coco/perlite? Is there any need to buffer pre-buffered coco, pre-charge pots with cal-mag, or rinse/flush known quality product lines vs. using it right out of the bag? [I use Canna coco with no prep, essentially never add cal-mag during grows, and 'buffer' my feed water with base nutrients (that are made to do this, here MegaCrop 2-part)].

As has been cited, buffering of coco refers to attaining the right concentrations of Ca/Mg ions strongly bound/adsorbed to the cellulose/fibers. Those saturating their pre-buffered coco-filled pots with cal-mag are all or mostly buffering their feed water solution, not the coco.

 

[Entombed]

I've only done one grow but I read a guide that said to flush low strength nute water through new coco and check the runoff EC. It gets rid of the dust and you can see if it's been prebuffered, not, or is just overloaded with whatever they used. Dunno if that's valid or correct but I did it.

 

[BII]

I've only done one grow but I read a guide that said to flush low strength nute water through new coco and check the runoff EC. It gets rid of the dust and you can see if it's been prebuffered, not, or is just overloaded with whatever they used. Dunno if that's valid or correct but I did it.

How do growers tell from runoff whether coco is properly pre-buffered (or not)? And how do growers know what 'buffering' should be done (or not) based on runoff?

[To me, too many unknowns with common buffering rituals. I use pre-buffered coco out of the bag]. If ppm/EC is zero or very low, does that mean the coco is optimally buffered, in balance, or that it is deficient in Ca/Mg (many biding sites empty) and needs a heavy dose of buffering? If ppm is high, how do you know if any or how much is from excess Ca/Mg vs. say Na ions? If ppms are not very low or high, then what do you do? If ppm's are high and you flush, do you flush until you get to zero or what ppm level? Cal-mag products vary a lot in their composition. If need to buffer, what type should optimally be used? How do you know what conc. Ca/Mg to use, for how long, etc.?

 

[Entombed]

How do growers tell from runoff whether coco is properly pre-buffered (or not)? And how do growers know what 'buffering' should be done (or not) based on runoff?

[To me, too many unknowns with common buffering rituals. I use pre-buffered coco out of the bag]. If ppm/EC is zero or very low, does that mean the coco is optimally buffered, in balance, or that it is deficient in Ca/Mg (many biding sites empty) and needs a heavy dose of buffering? If ppm is high, how do you know if any or how much is from excess Ca/Mg vs. say Na ions? If ppms are not very low or high, then what do you do? If ppm's are high and you flush, do you flush until you get to zero or what ppm level? Cal-mag products vary a lot in their composition. If need to buffer, what type should optimally be used? How do you know what conc. Ca/Mg to use, for how long, etc.?

Oh I think they just meant to check the runoff EC/ppm and see if it's way above what you were running through. I think they suggested using 350ppm and check the runoff to see if it is higher or the same. If it was unbuffered it would be close or lower and if it was significantly higher it was buffered. Also you could flush through if it was like 1000ppm until it came down.

 

[BII]

Oh I think they just meant to check the runoff EC/ppm and see if it's way above what you were running through. I think they suggested using 350ppm and check the runoff to see if it is higher or the same. If it was unbuffered it would be close or lower and if it was significantly higher it was buffered. Also you could flush through if it was like 1000ppm until it came down.

So initial runoff from (pre)buffered coco would have a higher ppm/EC? I presume the opposite, that quality pre-buffered coco doesn't shed bound ions/salts so easily. I presume runoff high ppm/EC indicates that buffering (obviously including washing/rinsing steps) wasn't or was poorly done, that the coco was contaminated with excess readily soluble, less strongly or non-bound, generally undesired ions/salts (Na, K, etc.).

 

[Entombed]

Yeah, it was just a way to check if it was over done I guess. Like I said I wasn't sure if it was valid or correct idea. You had some good points up above.