Grow Mediums HELP! DROOPING PLANTS
- Thread starter Tyler_Durden88
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I'm in soil and run a calcium based nute line that requires a high ph up to 6.8.. my gut reaction is ph... but we need all the info... there's a form at the top of the infirmary, get that info up... like you said dont want to misdiagnose...
But if your ph is really that high...6 to 6.5 is normal in soil, and most are probably around 6.2.
But if your ph is really that high...6 to 6.5 is normal in soil, and most are probably around 6.2.
Tyler_Durden88
It's all about the Trichomes
yea my ph is around 7.5 im using black gold organic soil and adding 2-2-2 in veg and the tiger bloom now in flower it was growing great i think im having soil compacting problems witch is holding the water too. Never using 5 gallon pails again. but the leafs are a little dark and somtimes after feeding have a little tinge of purple at the tips. Whats the best way to lower ph?
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Watering schedules will help you remember to check your plant, but only your plant can tell you when it needs water. Well... actually, the weight of the bucket is the best gauge. Fill a bucket with dry soil, lift it, and remember what that feels like. That's too dry. You want a good watering to result in about 25% or more run-off out the bottom. For example, if you poured in a gallon you would want 1 to 1.5 quarts runoff minimum. Then feel the weight of the bucket again. Don't water again until the bucket is much lighter. Another good gauge is the soil pullung away from the sides of the bucket. Don't let this go to extremes but it's a good sign.
5 gallon buckets are fine as long as you have plenty of drainage holes and a layer of straight vermiculite or better still grow rocks / hydrocorn at the bottom of the bucket.
Not sure what your soil moisture meter is telling you but the first thing I think of with leaf droop is over-watering. Funnily enough, lack of water does that too but you know the difference in wilt versus droop.
All other things said, it's entirely normal for the lower leaves of a plant to droop, yellow and fall off as the plant goes into bloom. It's the plant's natural way of moving nitrogen where it's most needed. You don't want this during veg but it can be tolerated / somewhat expected as you progress through the bloom cycle.
Best way to lower your pH is with a dolomite lime additive when first mixing the soil, but too late for that now. Just pH your water (and nutrients when feeding) to the low side around 6.3 before watering. EVERY TIME you water or feed be sure to adjust pH after mixing in nutrients.
I have not grown in dirt for many years, and I understand from our infirmary guru @Waira, there's a much improved method of measuring pH runoff than simply just checking runoff. I've tagged him here, hopefully he can drop you a link to the better way of checking dirt pH. IMHO, though, the BEST WAY is to buy a good dirt pH meter like BlueLabs. And final thought, you did mention you're using an organic soil, so just to be sure you know... it takes a few months for a true organic soil to acclimate itself and start balancing its pH for you. Including a healthy mix of dolomite lime (calcium) when the soil is "built" to start the buffering process for you. So until your worm poop and bat do-do and other shit has a chance to start doing its job, your organic soil is neither going to feed your plants nor control its own pH. That means amendments to feed your girls until your soil balances itself.
Then there's all the other stuff that could be going on. Give us your specifics of everything else & we'll see.
5 gallon buckets are fine as long as you have plenty of drainage holes and a layer of straight vermiculite or better still grow rocks / hydrocorn at the bottom of the bucket.
Not sure what your soil moisture meter is telling you but the first thing I think of with leaf droop is over-watering. Funnily enough, lack of water does that too but you know the difference in wilt versus droop.
7.5 pH is mos'def' too high, do fix that, although I don't recall this causing a drooping situation.
Normal pH range for dirt is about 6.3 to 7.0 but I always kept mine in the 6.5 to 6.8 range.All other things said, it's entirely normal for the lower leaves of a plant to droop, yellow and fall off as the plant goes into bloom. It's the plant's natural way of moving nitrogen where it's most needed. You don't want this during veg but it can be tolerated / somewhat expected as you progress through the bloom cycle.
Best way to lower your pH is with a dolomite lime additive when first mixing the soil, but too late for that now. Just pH your water (and nutrients when feeding) to the low side around 6.3 before watering. EVERY TIME you water or feed be sure to adjust pH after mixing in nutrients.
I have not grown in dirt for many years, and I understand from our infirmary guru @Waira, there's a much improved method of measuring pH runoff than simply just checking runoff. I've tagged him here, hopefully he can drop you a link to the better way of checking dirt pH. IMHO, though, the BEST WAY is to buy a good dirt pH meter like BlueLabs. And final thought, you did mention you're using an organic soil, so just to be sure you know... it takes a few months for a true organic soil to acclimate itself and start balancing its pH for you. Including a healthy mix of dolomite lime (calcium) when the soil is "built" to start the buffering process for you. So until your worm poop and bat do-do and other shit has a chance to start doing its job, your organic soil is neither going to feed your plants nor control its own pH. That means amendments to feed your girls until your soil balances itself.
Then there's all the other stuff that could be going on. Give us your specifics of everything else & we'll see.
Tyler_Durden88
It's all about the Trichomes
Thank you im actually starting to think it might be a little bit of both watering and ph problems. Ive also read that autos should get only a 1/4 strength of the recomended nutes bc of their smaller stature. Im gonna let the medium dry out completely b4 i water again. Ive heard that you can water with a little bit of viniger to lower ph. Anybody try this before? I should have added extra perilite. I have since with newer plants. Live and learn i guees just hate to see her sick she was growing sooo well. i am also growing in a basement and it dosent have very good air circulation. I just added a inline fan to suck in fresh air from outside direct to tent and a exhaust fan to pull old air out.
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Vinegar will work & it won't hurt anything but it won't remain stable. It might test ok immediately after using but by tomorrow it will drift back. A little pH down goes a long way so go ahead and make the purchase. Mix your nutes, test pH, then adjust. If you are on a water-only cycle, you should still test and adjust before watering the plants.
SOME auto strains are nute sensitive, especially during veg, but all I've grown seem to adapt normally during bloom. So 1/4 strength would probably be fine starting out but I'd try 1/3 to 1/2 strength minimum during bloom.
You are dirt so your feed method is referred to as drain-to-waste feeding - mix it up, pour it through, discard the runoff.. Drain-to-waste usually calls for 50% nute strength.
The color of your plants now is pale green, that's indicating borderline nitrogen deficiency. Soon as you get the drooping solved I would not be afraid to go a bit stronger. With 50% you're probably just fine. 1/4, probably too weak.
SOME auto strains are nute sensitive, especially during veg, but all I've grown seem to adapt normally during bloom. So 1/4 strength would probably be fine starting out but I'd try 1/3 to 1/2 strength minimum during bloom.
You are dirt so your feed method is referred to as drain-to-waste feeding - mix it up, pour it through, discard the runoff.. Drain-to-waste usually calls for 50% nute strength.
The color of your plants now is pale green, that's indicating borderline nitrogen deficiency. Soon as you get the drooping solved I would not be afraid to go a bit stronger. With 50% you're probably just fine. 1/4, probably too weak.
Tyler_Durden88
It's all about the Trichomes
Its in flower now should i still give it the veg nutes and bloom nutes or just bloom? i also have a shitload of chicken manure i can use. shes a little pale green compared to how dark green it was before. Shes starting to pick up a lil bit but still not getting color back yet.
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Sorry for the delayed reply, @Tyler_Durden88 , was away for the weekend.
When you started this thread you said they were 1 week into bloom, by now it's two weeks & you should be using a bloom based nutrient formula. But you also mentioned Black Gold organic soil and 2-2-2 and Tiger Bloom, that's a bit confusing. And I don't use Fox Farm, so I can't give you any expert advice on their product use, but I can say a few things that will keep you out of trouble.
First, to repeat what I said earlier, it takes a few months for a true organic soil to acclimate itself. Plus organic growing is a whole other ballgame with its own sets of rules, and our normal rules no longer apply. For that reason, until you are comfortable you have gained enough knowledge to try true organic growing, I would ignore that and treat your soil like it is any other inert medium that needs regular feedings to keep your plants healthy.
As to FoxFarm, I took a quick peep at their website and they have three base ingredients that make up their feed regimen. You need all three.
Grow Big (6-4-4) is your main source of Nitrogen and micronutrients, it is used through almost all of your grow.
Big Bloom (0 - 0.5 - 0.7) contains all your worm poop and bat do-do crap along with kelp and other stuff. It is not nutritionally strong, but contains good things to help condition your soil. This ingredient is used from start to finish of your grow.
Tiger Bloom (2 - 8 - 4) is your main source of phosphorous and potassium, along with some nitrogen. It is added to your plant once blooming shows (you are there).
All three of these ingredients need to be used through most of your entire grow. For exact specs, follow their feed chart located at :
https://www.foxfarmfertilizer.com/images/pdf/usa-soil-schedule-english_3-2018.pdf
The chart contains lots of additives, they help, but concentrate on getting the "big three" right and your plants should prosper.
I recommend a few deviations to their schedule:
1) Feeding in dirt is considered a drain-to-waste method and nutrient strength should be reduced to 50% of the manufacturer's recommendations. I find it simplest to use the amount-per-gallon listed in their feed chart, but added to two gallons of water. Or say you need six gallons to feed all your plants (with 25% run-off each watering) then use the amount for three gallons, added to six gallons of water. Use this mixture for your first feed cycle.
2) You do have an organic soil base, and any soil based medium benefits greatly from the addition of blackstrap molasses to your feed schedule. This will really kick-start your organics as well as providing some excellent micronutrients for your plants. You can get this at any grocery in the baking section, or online. Use 3-4 tablespoons per gallon of water - it's easiest to add this to one quart of hot - to - touch water to help dissolve, then mix this into the remainder of the gallon. Stir well, adjust pH, and use this for your second feed cycle.
3) For your third feed cycle, use pH'ed water only. If you are using RO water, then add cal-mag; but if you are using ground water of any other source (well, city, etc.) just pH-ed water.
After these three cycles go back to 1), nutrient cycle. Follow this regimen and you should not have any nutrient problems, assuming you don't over-water. Within a couple of weeks good color should return to your plants.
For the time being I would forego the chicken shit, that takes too long to become usable by the plants.
When you started this thread you said they were 1 week into bloom, by now it's two weeks & you should be using a bloom based nutrient formula. But you also mentioned Black Gold organic soil and 2-2-2 and Tiger Bloom, that's a bit confusing. And I don't use Fox Farm, so I can't give you any expert advice on their product use, but I can say a few things that will keep you out of trouble.
First, to repeat what I said earlier, it takes a few months for a true organic soil to acclimate itself. Plus organic growing is a whole other ballgame with its own sets of rules, and our normal rules no longer apply. For that reason, until you are comfortable you have gained enough knowledge to try true organic growing, I would ignore that and treat your soil like it is any other inert medium that needs regular feedings to keep your plants healthy.
As to FoxFarm, I took a quick peep at their website and they have three base ingredients that make up their feed regimen. You need all three.
Grow Big (6-4-4) is your main source of Nitrogen and micronutrients, it is used through almost all of your grow.
Big Bloom (0 - 0.5 - 0.7) contains all your worm poop and bat do-do crap along with kelp and other stuff. It is not nutritionally strong, but contains good things to help condition your soil. This ingredient is used from start to finish of your grow.
Tiger Bloom (2 - 8 - 4) is your main source of phosphorous and potassium, along with some nitrogen. It is added to your plant once blooming shows (you are there).
All three of these ingredients need to be used through most of your entire grow. For exact specs, follow their feed chart located at :
https://www.foxfarmfertilizer.com/images/pdf/usa-soil-schedule-english_3-2018.pdf
The chart contains lots of additives, they help, but concentrate on getting the "big three" right and your plants should prosper.
I recommend a few deviations to their schedule:
1) Feeding in dirt is considered a drain-to-waste method and nutrient strength should be reduced to 50% of the manufacturer's recommendations. I find it simplest to use the amount-per-gallon listed in their feed chart, but added to two gallons of water. Or say you need six gallons to feed all your plants (with 25% run-off each watering) then use the amount for three gallons, added to six gallons of water. Use this mixture for your first feed cycle.
2) You do have an organic soil base, and any soil based medium benefits greatly from the addition of blackstrap molasses to your feed schedule. This will really kick-start your organics as well as providing some excellent micronutrients for your plants. You can get this at any grocery in the baking section, or online. Use 3-4 tablespoons per gallon of water - it's easiest to add this to one quart of hot - to - touch water to help dissolve, then mix this into the remainder of the gallon. Stir well, adjust pH, and use this for your second feed cycle.
3) For your third feed cycle, use pH'ed water only. If you are using RO water, then add cal-mag; but if you are using ground water of any other source (well, city, etc.) just pH-ed water.
After these three cycles go back to 1), nutrient cycle. Follow this regimen and you should not have any nutrient problems, assuming you don't over-water. Within a couple of weeks good color should return to your plants.
For the time being I would forego the chicken shit, that takes too long to become usable by the plants.
Give this feed regimen a try asap and your plants should improve quickly.
virginia gent
hanna and toby
I don't switch to bloom nutes until vertical growth stops and you can see resin without magnifying, day 35-40 mostly. I am using black gold potting soil also and feed
as well. Even though potting soil has perlite it is not enough add 1pt/gal, and it needs lime, about 2/3 cup in 5 gallons pails. Sometimes wilt/droop comes from slow drainage. Color is a nute problem or more than likely ph. will salt up, after 3 or 4 weeks try sledgehammer or clean with 10-15 gallons ph 6.5-6.7 plain water. I also use cal/mag between feedings. I use almost all of "dirty dozen" bushdoctor line of products. Real organic soil takes time to set or blend fully, maybe 1-2 months and it smells but imo it is the best for quality. I just started using this potting soil so I am still testing a bit. I keep my led at 24 inches for veg and 18 inches for bloom if the girls don't like it tie them down (they love it). Good luck.Similar threads
