Grow Mediums AutoPots and pH instability, could it be your water source?

Joined
Feb 9, 2013
Messages
1,538
Reputation
0
Reaction score
4,625
Points
0
I did a bit of research and came across this stuff in hopes of finding pH stability when using my AutoPot system.

http://www.thehydrosource.com/house-garden-ph-osmosis-stabilizer.html

After a bit more of reading, I found a thread with some more info that opened my eyes a bit. We Autoflower guys who tend to feed CalMag during flower, could this be an issue for us? I would like this to be an informative thread and like to hear HELPFUL FEEDBACK from people that could help the community as a whole.




Finding Balance: Factors Affecting pH in Hydroponic Systems by Eric Hopper

Hydroponic growers understand the important role a stable pH plays in the performance of their garden. Sustaining proper pH levels ensures your plants maintain the maximum nutrient uptake level and large beneficial microbial population needed for a flourishing hydroponic garden. It doesn’t take long when monitoring the pH of a nutrient solution to realize that the pH is not a “set it and forget it” parameter. In fact, pH is continuously fluctuating. There are three major factors that contribute to pH fluctuation in a hydroponic system: the water itself, the nutrients used in the water and the medium or substrate used in the hydroponic system.

Water

Many growers do not know that water’s pH will fluctuate on its own depending on the surrounding environment. Reverse osmosis and freshly distilled water start with a relatively neutral pH (around 7.0), but the pH of this water will actually lower when this water is exposed to air. This is because the water absorbs carbon dioxide from the surrounding air. This fluctuation can be intensified in grow rooms that supplement CO2, which is one of the reasons why so many indoor horticulturalists who supplement CO2 experience difficulty balancing their pH. In a CO2-enriched environment, it is not uncommon for neutral water to drop to a pH of 5.0 within a few hours. One way to minimize this effect is to remove the reservoir from the growing environment so it will not be exposed to high levels of CO2. Hydroponic systems where the nutrient solution makes minimal contact with the growing environment are less affected by the CO2-caused pH-lowering phenomenon.

Tap water is even worse in terms of pH instability because it is chock full of elements that will affect pH. Calcium and magnesium, which are known to cause pH instabilities, are probably the largest contributors to pH fluctuations in tap water. This is one of the reasons why so many hydroponic growers use filtration devices to remove excessive amounts of these elements found in tap water. Growers with hard water often experience constant problems with pH stabilization due to the high concentration of calcium and magnesium.

Nutrients

The nutrients used by hydroponic growers also have a direct influence on the solution’s pH. In fact, the higher the concentration (measured in parts per million), the greater the influence nutrients have over the pH of the solution. Nutrients affect pH in a few different ways. First, as the chemical compounds are broken down by enzymes or microorganisms, some are absorbed by the plant, but the remaining portion is left in the solution to contribute to the pH. For example, when a chemical compound is broken down for nutrient absorption and produces leftover molecules that are alkaline, the pH of the solution will rise (become more alkaline).

It’s not just the remaining molecules and their pH that affect the solution’s overall pH, however. The plants themselves, as they absorb nutrient ions, give off ions in return. For example, when a plant absorbs potassium ions, it gives off hydrogen ions in return. Hydrogen ions are acidic and result in a lowering of the pH. On the other hand, a plant gives off hydroxyl ions when it absorbs nitrogen ions, resulting in a rise of pH.

Growing medium

Last, but not least, is the medium. Although most growing mediums are stable, their chemical composition still affects the pH of the nutrient solution. There are countless chemical and biochemical processes happening in and around the medium, all of which affect the pH of the nutrient solution. Hydroponic gardening has an extremely high absorption rate and, teamed with a comparably high concentration of nutrients, the medium is ultra-sensitive to these chemical and biochemical processes. In nature, soil acts as a large-volume natural pH stabilizer. The pH stabilizer in hydroponic gardens is the solution itself, which is extremely weak in terms of being an effective buffer. As the concentration of a nutrient solution changes due to absorption by the plant or evaporation of the water, the pH will also change.

Hydroponic gardening speeds up virtually every biological process and, in turn, can accelerate pH fluctuations. In order to maintain a pH “sweet spot,” growers must gain a heightened understanding of all the contributing factors that affect the pH of the nutrient solution.
 
Good find, good write-up...... that's the reasons why I'm considering a Bluelab Guardian Connect for my Autopots and WaterFarms https://www.bluelab.com/products/type/connect-suite/guardian-monitor-connect or something similar.

pH is a finicky animal, it's like a 14 year old teenager......reason is out the window,you never know what to expect, and it's a constant struggle to maintain a semblance of control.....lol
 
Temperature also plays a role, albeit minor, which is why a pH meter with ATC (Automatic Temperature Compensation) is preferable, but in case such is not available here's an easy way around it

https://www.hamzasreef.com/Contents/Calculators/PhTempCorrection.php

or you can get a pretty good idea from this chart

pHtempCorrection.pdf.png
 
Last edited:
I've found sodium bicarbonate ( baking soda ) to be an excellent ph up. add it after you make your solution and ph stays stable. And the amount you use is so tiny, there's no concern over the sodium. I'm talking adding a few ppms per 5 gallons! I usually use less than an 1/8 tsp.

Automated ph control though is definitely nice for bigger systems!
 
good topic as i have been noticing this myself with my grows

i have a blue lab gardian which shows my PH rises within 24 hours

i do have an air pump circulating water and also i just use the water from the tap and adjust to 5.8.

my next grow i am going to have a spare res where i leave that water sat for longer, at least 24 hours and see if that settles the PH levels. also i have read about the air pump circulating can cause this.
 
Mine rises without pumps/stones. Now I have pH meter and I will watch closely.
 
Mine rises without pumps/stones. Now I have pH meter and I will watch closely.
do you let the water sit before hand or just get from the tap and adjust.
as the next morning it rises to appox 6.2 for me when originally 5.8, i am then using ph down to adjust to 5.8. it basically stays stable then however having to do this every feed or res change, i cant help think it can be improved by stabilizing before as ph down cant be good for the plant.
 
do you let the water sit before hand or just get from the tap and adjust.
as the next morning it rises to appox 6.2 for me when originally 5.8, i am then using ph down to adjust to 5.8. it basically stays stable then however having to do this every feed or res change, i cant help think it can be improved by stabilizing before as ph down cant be good for the plant.

I let tap water sit for 2 days before using it, to evaporate chlorine and other sh*t.
 
You might consider using AN pH Perfect, Remo or other base nutrients that claim to be be very pH variation-tolerant, with their optimally chelated nutrients available to the plants over a wider range than others, particularly if you start with low salt/EC/ppm water. I and I'm sure many others use these AN pH Perfect nutrients with Auto-Pots, and like my self haven't bothered to check feed pH for years. pH of the nutes going in is simply irrelevant (if using still-fresh nutes prepared using low salts/ppm water). And adjusting pH of these base nutrient products is counter-productive, just involves adding more useless background ions/salts making it harder for these nutes to work properly through a wide pH range.

My plants get the great majority of their calcium, magnesium and silicon through foliar feeding (other than when buds have fully formed). I use Transport for top-of-leaf foliar feeding. Good-old bottom-leaf foliar feeding with surfactant should work well enough (but likely not as well). That way, I very effectively get these ions/salts into the plants while avoiding adding these to the feed water, with this greatly reducing feed water ions/salt/ppm content.
 
Back
Top