Mg def, or light intensity?

[Animatey]

Too

Well, here's one for the lesson book. In the process of adjusting the nute mix to the new standard I had in mind, I found out that the EC in the reservoir was over 2000. The @#$!@#$!@ EC meter had apparently been accidentally on PPM, and yours truly did not notice. I guess that the mode switch between EC and PPM is a tad tight to the power switch for my stubby fingers. It is possible that the plants have been on 2000EC for the last two reservoir top ups, or the better part of a week. Annoyed, me? Maybe just a bit.

Anyway, the reservoir and feed lines are now all full with the intended solution, so I will watch for a few days to see how things go. My guess is that my screwup has caused who knows how much mischief in the lockout department. Presumably it will be a while leveling out. I considered flushing with the proper nute mix, but figured the shock might do more harm than good given the EC difference. Better perhaps for the EC to move down gradually for a day or two as new mix is sucked into the pots. Plus, getting a lot of nute solution to the top of the pots at this point would be a bit of a challenge given the density of stems and leaves. Grumble. Not F***ing amused.

Too much Phosphorus starts as Zn lockout from what I've read. Good luck, sounds like you got it sorted!

 

[Waira]

coulda been worse,.... but you would have seen major nute burn right quick if it had been the other way around, 2000+ppm!
1.0EC (millisiemens, not micro') = 500ppm in most units, so your 2000EC/2.0EC equals 1000ppm, right? -- high, but not crazy high... nute burn will fry top to bottom more or less all at once as well, no mistaking it.... I don't see that in the plants, though some lowers do show what looks like some slight yellowing on the margin "teeth"; this is usually a K issue, but ironically both K tox' and defc. present much the same!

Ca-Mg jacks up the ppm's really fast, so if you've been running light on the actual NPK and other non-Ca/Mg nute elements, the apparent micro' defc. would make sense,... light stress (if a factor here) can exacerbate this....
Thanks to that coco site info, it's clear that large shifts in EC are something the roots dislike very much, and may retard even more uptake and response time and effects.... Best you can do now I think is look at which part carries the Zn/Fe most, and up that in %, and use as a foliar... got kelp? that can have significant micro's too....

 

[Olderfart]

coulda been worse,.... but you would have seen major nute burn right quick if it had been the other way around, 2000+ppm!
1.0EC (millisiemens, not micro') = 500ppm in most units, so your 2000EC/2.0EC equals 1000ppm, right? -- high, but not crazy high... nute burn will fry top to bottom more or less all at once as well, no mistaking it.... I don't see that in the plants, though some lowers do show what looks like some slight yellowing on the margin "teeth"; this is usually a K issue, but ironically both K tox' and defc. present much the same!

Ca-Mg jacks up the ppm's really fast, so if you've been running light on the actual NPK and other non-Ca/Mg nute elements, the apparent micro' defc. would make sense,... light stress (if a factor here) can exacerbate this....
Thanks to that coco site info, it's clear that large shifts in EC are something the roots dislike very much, and may retard even more uptake and response time and effects.... Best you can do now I think is look at which part carries the Zn/Fe most, and up that in %, and use as a foliar... got kelp? that can have significant micro's too....

Yes, the conversion on my meter is 500ppm/1000EC.

Thanks Waira, I will do a foliar feed and increase the micro side in the reservoir tonight. The plants are not looking any worse tonight, but not a lot better either. Tomorrow might bring some improvement. The good news, perhaps, is that the plants are sucking back the nute mix more than ever. I'll keep you posted. Thanks again for your help with this.

ps. Yeah, 2000+ ppm would have been entertaining. If I had to screw up with the mode switch, I did it in the best direction.

 

[Olderfart]

Three days on @Waira , and not much improvement in leaf colour on the CQ in spite of good continuing growth. Lights are dialed back to ~265 watts at ~24" for now, nute mix is still ~1010 EC, pH 5.8-6.2 ( I have been varying it deliberately). I have done multiple foliars of the same mix. If leaf color does not improve soon, I will switch to Megacrop at same EC to see if that helps. I was going to switch to Megacrop later toward bloom, but given this business, may do the switch earlier.

 

[Olderfart]

Day 4 since nute adjustment and foliar started, to more or less bugger all effect, so I switched to Megacrop 1200EC pH6.0 this afternoon, no cal mag for now. I put ~1.5 gal of the MC through the CQ, runoff was ~950 EC, 5.8pH, so just fine. All three plants are still growing fine, but CQ new growth still has yellowing. Perhaps whatever the CQ needs will be more available in MC. We shall see.

I will update grow journal later this week with results to day 40.

 

[Waira]

With micronute defc.'s, they can be difficult to "fix", aka reverse,... I've had some that just could not get caught up, newest leaves showed it, but older ones started correcting slowly,... Any effect on the older leaves yet?
The only thing I have seen kick absolute butt is using Optic Foliar's Transport with Earth Juice Microblast.... I did a review here of it....
This plant was persistent, likely genetic, since she showed this from early on. I treated for weeks and weeks, but could not quell it until I used this... Finally seemed to get enough in to halt it permanently, and in under a week,.... 3 days saw marked improvement!
Transport is a carrier solution that can temporarily penetrate the cuticle layer of the leaf, taking whatever is dissolved in it along for the ride...
Something else that may help is a pure fulvic liquid called Ful-Power (BioAg), amazing stuff! Fulvic is small enough to be taken into the cells, and utilized, but it also chelates nicely... any foliar I do includes it!
Shoot me some new pics when you can,...

 

[Olderfart]

With micronute defc.'s, they can be difficult to "fix", aka reverse,... I've had some that just could not get caught up, newest leaves showed it, but older ones started correcting slowly,... Any effect on the older leaves yet?
The only thing I have seen kick absolute butt is using Optic Foliar's Transport with Earth Juice Microblast.... I did a review here of it....
This plant was persistent, likely genetic, since she showed this from early on. I treated for weeks and weeks, but could not quell it until I used this... Finally seemed to get enough in to halt it permanently, and in under a week,.... 3 days saw marked improvement!
Transport is a carrier solution that can temporarily penetrate the cuticle layer of the leaf, taking whatever is dissolved in it along for the ride...
Something else that may help is a pure fulvic liquid called Ful-Power (BioAg), amazing stuff! Fulvic is small enough to be taken into the cells, and utilized, but it also chelates nicely... any foliar I do includes it!
Shoot me some new pics when you can,...

Hi Waira,

Not a lot of improvement in older growth color, certainly nothing that leaps out at me. The plants are still growing though, and drinking lots. I am still doing multiple foliar applications of the micro heavy mix of Technaflora. The new growth may be improving, but not enough big stuff yet to be sure. I will do pics tomorrow if I get time.

It's mainly the CQ that has suffered, both 24C's seem happy.

 

[Olderfart]

With micronute defc.'s, they can be difficult to "fix", aka reverse,... I've had some that just could not get caught up, newest leaves showed it, but older ones started correcting slowly,... Any effect on the older leaves yet?
The only thing I have seen kick absolute butt is using Optic Foliar's Transport with Earth Juice Microblast.... I did a review here of it....
This plant was persistent, likely genetic, since she showed this from early on. I treated for weeks and weeks, but could not quell it until I used this... Finally seemed to get enough in to halt it permanently, and in under a week,.... 3 days saw marked improvement!
Transport is a carrier solution that can temporarily penetrate the cuticle layer of the leaf, taking whatever is dissolved in it along for the ride...
Something else that may help is a pure fulvic liquid called Ful-Power (BioAg), amazing stuff! Fulvic is small enough to be taken into the cells, and utilized, but it also chelates nicely... any foliar I do includes it!
Shoot me some new pics when you can,...

Hi @Waira ,

No pics yesterday, puppy minding duties and other stuff used up the day. I will try to get some out later today. Plants are still growing well, and the new growth on the CQ seems improved, but the jury is not quite in. The old growth may be improving slightly, but not a whole lot. the 24C's seem happier than the CQ, both are growing well. All plants are starting to flower nicely.

Thanks for your help with this Waira, I appreciate it.

 

[Olderfart]

Hello again @Waira,

Here are the photos I promised:

Detailed view of part of plant:

Less detailed view:

Comments would be more than welcome. This is about a week after I "fixed" the nute screwup, and about half that since I changed from Technaflora 3 part to Megacrop. The pictures were taken when things were a tad on the dry side, ~26C and 45%RH, but likely that dry only for a few hours after the house thermostat turned up the heat for the day.

Thanks for any help you can offer.

 

[Waira]

... they look better than the original pics OF, so that's a good sign,... Did I mention that immobile micronute defc.'s are a bitch to fix? .... I looks similar to what I went through with some of mine in the past... it's getting in, but not getting ahead, micro's are getting used up as fast as it goes in, so with little to spare, full correction is slow if ever.... Did you check out that Optic Foliar link?
As they grow/stretch, and getting closer to the lights, that can become a mitigating factor,.. I do see a lot of folding, so called "canoe'ing", which is usually a response to overly strong light.. the leaves are trying to shape themselves so as to reduce the directness of the light striking the plant,... I'm told that the so called "praying" (strongly upward angling) is also a response to this,... So, let's double check on this, what lights are where, how close,... And I forget your light schedule? If it's 24/0, get off that ASAP.... From what I see and read, with little exception, the difference between 24/0 and 20/4 is so small it's basically pointless.....
T and RH% are fine!
Have you evaluated the micronute content between both nute lines? I'm not sure if one is better than the other,...
Foliars still happening? that too can be overdone, and the build-up on the leaf a potential issue,... a clean rinse may be wise if they look hazed over with residues,.....
MC is better at veg' than bloom, a common opinion by users here,... look into using a PK booster, MC has plenty of K, but is weak on P IMO,...their Bud Explosion is very K heavy, better for later stages bloom, not so much for earlier....
Did you say you found some EJ Microblast?