great read and insight into the business side of things. and some mighty tough decisions to be made. myself,i'm very wary of the 50/50 deal. I'm not sure of the legality, but if you do go route 3, make sure to have a lawyer on hand to cover your ass. did the same thing when I was still in the tattoo biz.1st time got really ugly but the second time thru went with a lawyer and a contract with a loophole or 2 in my favor. but I'm sure you are on top of things as always.good luck with your future endeavors.
Mephisto Genetics Spannabis Stories and the future of Mephisto Genetics..!
- Thread starter mephisto
- Start date
Hey Guys,
We are just about recovered from the weekend, for us it's a pretty intense time.
An imalgamation of smoking, drinking, walking, networking and meetings sure takes it's tole even on some young guns like us
First of all, this isn't a pictorial, unfortunately I barely managed a few images, but for those who want to read on, I think it's pretty interesting.
It was our 3rd spannabis here, and each year we've seen a lot of the same faces.
An example I will say is, The first year we were a bit aimless, just wondering around and taking everything in, it's a pretty crazy experience if you're used to canna and smoking all being behind closed doors or in the park at night.
But at the time, we had just completed our first feminised seed run here in our new strange location. We had spent an ardous few weeks sat de-seeding.
So if anything we wanted to uncover the knowledge from some of the big boys and what they do.
So we thought it can't hurt to ask, and the closest stand to us was the humbolt seeds/dinafem combo. For those who may not know, both companies I think share management and are under the umbrella of 'la mota' one of the top two distributors here in spain.
We thought with them producing some millions of seeds a year they may have some crazy machine, but the advice was 'a big sloping table'.
We also got to hang out with jorge and went to a restaurant which is half a fishmongers. You order your types of fish by weight, and if you want to eat there, they toss it on the grill, no sauce just a slice of lemon.
Still it was a really great an eye opening time.
Since day one here we have hit the ground running with the mephisto projects, but at the time of year 2 spannabis we were deep into the Mephisto Projects, we were de-seeding the f4 run of the 2014 strains. Armed with a tablet loaded with photos and a flyer we'd had printed at the last minute,
that was pretty much all we had other than talk and some samples. And after attending the friday in our civilian wares (we had ordered some transfer type t-shirts to be made weeks prior, but they got lost in the post) We went on an endeavor to get something printed.
Spending hours running around the city, we decided our last and only option was to buy some transfer paper, and print our own design and iron it on..
Of course we had no iron, or printer or any of those things, so we stayed up until 4am trialling, but worked our way through all of our t-shirts.
Up at the crack of dawn we went to the hypermarket, with pretty much our last 80 euros of cash in hand. Niether of our cards were working.
Anyway we did pull it off, and looked presentable for one day only.
The samples were well received but, well.. not many people will turn their noses up.
We also had the same samples tested, but we were too nervous to enter them into a competition incase they bombed. Actually we would have come out pretty well, but hindsight is always 20-20 right
We saw our friends the second year at humbolt, and they mentioned that because of their advertising costs and so forth, we would need stocks of 60'000 seeds of each strain in order to be stocked/distributed by la mota.
And, to be honest with us working projects as well as producing, it's very very unlikely we'd reach that level.
But it wasn't such a big deal, we had an offer from seedsman to stock us and it's been very sweet and easy dealing with them so far.
However this year, we were so much more prepared, and had a goodie bag prepared, with stickers, catalogue, poster, freebie seeds, business cards. I was actually pretty chuffed with how they came out.
Now 3 boys donning mephisto hoodies, the catalogue and samples of our 2015 strains, a long with a body of work and growing experience, the vibe was good.
Again we saw familiar faces, the herbies media guys, our local grow shop which they let us use as the mephisto spannabis base, the writer who wrote our article for weedworld, jaime from resin seeds and more i'm sure.
Some new stands/faces. We were browsing the dutch passion/crazy led's combo stand, saw they were the hs1's and had a little chat, flicked through the laminated display book, and low and behold some photos from the led/hps grow!
Also on the end of the stand was a device to the tune of 40'000 euros, a tabletop cannabinoid analysis machine.You place a sample of bud over the light, press a button on the ipad and a few seconds later you have a reading.
And our reading's came out well indeed!, I believe 14% through to 20.1 %, however I didn't like the method as clever as the machine may be.
You can pluck off some little fragments of bud, or grind a bud, but either way all that finger/grinder contact (especially a crystal catching grinder) has got to be detrimental to the levels displayed.
We wanted to get testing done three ways and write a big piece on it, 1 being tested by canna, even though at the fair they said it's not like lab conditions as there are many things that can affect the results there, from a springy floor, to temperature, and I imagine the sheer quantity of samples they have to test.
Either way we met two very nice chaps there and a good solid contact for future testing.
They were only able to test out S.O.D.K for us, with a result of 19.2% thc!, they say due to the conditions results could be out of whack by 5% more or less, but it still provided a good indication.
Test 3 was conducted by Alpha-cat again, although they didn't have a stand due to re-locating to prague and developing new products, they held a small competition 'cannabinoid masters' at a smoking club near to us.
And guess what! We got a 3rd place in the flowers category! I believe there was in the region of 40 entrants, and with walter white testing at 17.7% with them we nailed it!
No cup or anything, but a mini-victory for us and the auto's.
Also we managed to snag a meeting with the boss at dinafem, so it took 3 years to get behind the curtain!
But some interesting discussions, the guy said 'I never really go on forums, but one day I went on one, and found a thread about some english guys who had moved to spain to grow autos in the woods, and their basement flooded amongst other things'
I was like: yes, that was us!
Some more general conversation, explaining how we work. I think it was re-freshing to them to know we were growers/smokers/and putting the work in.
A lot of companies in spain are marketing exercises or the general quality they see doesn't impress them.
He said we have a high quality product, but a small brand.. which is a very fair comment as we are of course nothing in comparison to the giants out there. And especially here in spain we aren't at all known.
He filled us in on ways to stay safe and also some ways the market was working, people who had copied for a long time but then did some breeding work and were afraid to release it because they were afraid of being copied themselves.
I understood, but said, I expect to be copied, but because we are continually working on new projects and advancing our own genetics, even if people do copy we will be 1-1.5 years ahead.
That's the hope anyway.
Really it's quite terrible here, but common place for each seedbank to buy stock off the other seedbanks if they have similar strains, if one goes out of stock and has an order to fulfil they can utilise each other.
(Not naming any names, just heard it on the grapevine several times over)
I explained that we do everything, as although I'm not a control freak, I hold even our little brand to the highest standards, and if I or people become careless, then what's the point.
Another interesting guy to chat to was loompa, of loompafarms. We obtained some Yeti OG seeds from him, as he said it's his most mould resistant strain and very high quality.. another one to test this summer in our wet wet woods!
A little story to round things off, and actually gave us a lot of inspiration was, a couple of years ago we attended growmed in valencia - a fair that's no longer running, we attended to give jorge a helping hand, but we met a cool if not eccentric american guy.
Imagine a surfer looking dude in his late 50's in a boiler suit with his chest wig on display, and he was wheeling around a home made LED unit, and man this thing was heavy.. I mean impossible to hang in a tent, a lot of kilos.
All three days there he was wheeling it and wheeling it. Super rad guy, he invited us to come back to valencia and hang out with him, but we had no money at the time and didn't keep in contact.
Then at the spannabis last year, again, on his own wheeling this contraption around the fair, and we wondered would he give up, would he be doing this for years to come?
This year he's only gone and got his own stand, an LED brand being produced elsewhere, and I think a small line of seeds too. As well, as starting the initiative for another fair in valencia in october.
We took some photos with him, and it really put a smile on our faces.
Needless to say, next year we will have a stand!
We also met the guys from Sickmeds seeds, and went for some beers with them. Tenerife sounds like a great place to be situated as well, it has 44 smoking clubs and a big growing culture, as well as really nice year round weather.
(Sat here with cold feet in Northern Spain, it sounds quite appealing.) But we are going to send them out autos to test, and they've put some goodies in the mail for us to.
They have set up a lab, so getting deep into testing and the medicinal side of things. Good chaps!
....................................
So now, we're kind of left scratching our heads as to the direction that we want our little seed co. to take.
The plan before was to amass a decent stock level from this coming season, which would free us up to just do project work and attend more tradeshows.
Incidentally another little highlight was to meet always auto's from here, it's super cool to get feedback and a pat on the back from people in real life.
Being away for just three days from the forums and having a delay in sending out our private/direct orders, really highlighted that if we want to get around, get more exposure and meet more of you guys..
(an upcoming thread was going to be 'where do you want to see mephisto in 2016?' then something has to give.
I love the work we are doing, but also it has really been non-stop for 2.5 years almost. It's cool where we are too, but I want to see more places, meet more people, get some strange
I can also no longer be a one-man-band, as we are getting more orders it's becoming harder, not impossible, but harder.
But in a lot, but especially this industry.. it's hard, to find people that are trustworthy, will take pride in their work or share our vision. After all a boss and a worker will always see things differently, but I want to build a lasting team, that becomes a well oiled machine and keeps the quality of every aspect as high as possible.
So, we are kind of left with three options:
Stay as we are, 3 amigos doing the best we can. More control, but limited to the hands we have and the hours in a day.
We would most likely have to put a pin in direct orders.
I love dealing with you guys, but everyday I have a decent sized commute to the Post office, when I sometimes feel I should be waking up and being with my plants.
I'm confident we could take on another distributor and everyone would be in good hands.
Option 2 - self expansion -
The difficulty is drafting in good people, especially in a new country to us. Like with Bill our newest member, he's a longterm friend, he doesn't have a growing background, but is a very clever capable lad and overtime he's seeing and helping with all processes here.
However most of our friends aren't in the position to up-sticks and come here, family, commitments etc
But if we could build a team like that, it would free us up to do these expo's, keep our direct orders going, it's more risk, more investments, but ultimately more control.
Option 3 - Today we had an offer.
Our grow shop would like us to combine forces..
We have a good relationship with them, they are professional, have great contacts and a solid team of people in place. Distribution links in spain and south america.
They have an office, would handle the accounts, business and orders. And can help us up production.
This would free us up solely to handle development of genetics.
But... and big but, we split the company 50/50 with them.
A bit of a quandary you could say right now in the MG house.
Anyway, thoughts are always appreciated from you good folks! Nothing like an AFN sounding board!.
Mitch, whatever you do, DON'T give up control of your company! Been there, done that, its a dream killer to anyone who runs his/her own business for reasons other than shear profit, and I know your not in it just for the money. You've come far from a humble beginning, and have far to go. It may take longer doing it on your own, but you can reach any level you desire and not have to answer to anyone. My best friend and I, started a computer business in his garage with only $1000 startup- money. Three years later, from a nice, retail location, we did over $300,000 in business, and it was just the two of us. We never borrowed a dime! We ran our business on the principal of NOT doing it like everyone else did. We never told a customer, we can't, or we don't . We would search for and get for our customer, obscure parts no one else would even bother trying. We dealt with the obsolete to the cutting edge. Why were we successful? You know, Mitch, because its part of your way of doing business also, and that is, ALWAYS respect your customers, yourself, and your business. I love your genetics, but I buy from you because you represent the ethics all businesses should strive for.
And we, the people who love your strains, are here to help you build your business!
greenjeans
Hydroponic Heretic
You need to find a couple of intelligent minimum-wage workers to do your shipping and customer service, bro. You are a company owner.. Make that work for you. Pursue your craft and pursue wider distribution. Leave the grunt-work to the grunts. Don't give anyone half! You will regret that down the line, IMO.
-2 cents from a highly intelligent nobody who is new to this scene.
-2 cents from a highly intelligent nobody who is new to this scene.
TimeTraveler
User of Advanced Lunar Technology
Chiming in to agree with pop and green: don't lose half the company!
What's made mephisto great is what you're doing already: the attention to detail, the refusal to compromise, and the focus on your collective vision. The very reason you're in the quandry you're in is BECAUSE what you're doing works! Failed companies never find their owners saying "Gosh, how am I supposed to handle all these CUSTOMERS throwing their money at me?".
I wish I had advice to give on how to handle your problem beyond "Don't try option C", as I understand you're in a hard spot. All I can say is you've overcome bigger obstacles than this getting to where you are now; finding just a couple reliable people to handle the grunt work (as greenjeans suggested) has got to be a goal you guys can reach! I'm sure just a pair of hands to help clean seeds, pack and ship orders, and file papers would be a tremendous load off and let you focus.
If nothing else, maybe a cattle call among the afn family for helping hands? Enough people have offered to run to Spain to see the farm and be a part of it, you might find at least one or two that are serious and could pass an interview with you.
I'd offer, but I'm far too entrenched in my personal life and career to move to rural Spain without one hell of a good cover story. Whatever you decide, good luck to you guys. It's taken only a few weeks for me to go from "Who are these guys?" to "Customer for Life". I want to see the story of Mephisto Genetics get bigger and have a happy ending for its founders.
What's made mephisto great is what you're doing already: the attention to detail, the refusal to compromise, and the focus on your collective vision. The very reason you're in the quandry you're in is BECAUSE what you're doing works! Failed companies never find their owners saying "Gosh, how am I supposed to handle all these CUSTOMERS throwing their money at me?".
I wish I had advice to give on how to handle your problem beyond "Don't try option C", as I understand you're in a hard spot. All I can say is you've overcome bigger obstacles than this getting to where you are now; finding just a couple reliable people to handle the grunt work (as greenjeans suggested) has got to be a goal you guys can reach! I'm sure just a pair of hands to help clean seeds, pack and ship orders, and file papers would be a tremendous load off and let you focus.
If nothing else, maybe a cattle call among the afn family for helping hands? Enough people have offered to run to Spain to see the farm and be a part of it, you might find at least one or two that are serious and could pass an interview with you.
I'd offer, but I'm far too entrenched in my personal life and career to move to rural Spain without one hell of a good cover story. Whatever you decide, good luck to you guys. It's taken only a few weeks for me to go from "Who are these guys?" to "Customer for Life". I want to see the story of Mephisto Genetics get bigger and have a happy ending for its founders.
mephisto
AFN Authorized Vendor
Yes mate, we are making ends meat and surviving in a tough industry, and more importantly we are out of debt, and like you say it's not all about the benjamins for us, at all. I also remember back talking with the guys from option 3 almost a year a go, and they were saying dinafem do this and so and so does that, and i'll quote myself here saying 'I don't want to be the next dinafem' , If we can progress and do well working with what we have, then we'll be happy.
Sure, no matter how much I like someone, we've learnt unfortunately gentlemans agreements don't seem to work thesedays!
Thanks pop, nice little pick me up story there.!
To be honest, educated or not, I've never really been on anything more than minimum wage in whatever industry i've been breaking my balls in
But you're right, To be company owners is a different mindset, and we've only just established the company so to be downgraded now seems a little silly. Cheers for your input.Hey dude, I was thinking exactly the same thing today actually, It's a different type of stress, and when I think about it it's a good type of stress in comparison to our previous 'what the hell are we doing here, not a penny to rub together, ahh I really don't want to go back to england stress' - we made it through that and I think we'll make it through this just fine.
Also and this is another 'problem', the farm is now at maximum capacity for living and working, every inch of space has a purpose. So is it time to find farm #2?
Big thanks to all of you guys anyway, things are starting to calm back down, and there's no rush or pressure to do anything immediate or rash, I'm sure everything will evolve and work out for the best. I think it was just going to the fair, speaking to so many people and being pulled in so many directions and having so many ideas fired at us, which was exciting of course and get's our minds thinking of the future, which is also a good thing.
medic grower
Tha Kushy Padawan
If you ever need a Household Dude for Farm 2 holla at me Bro. I really need to get out of Germany this Country maes me sick.....
jackmc
Killing them softley
Hi Mitch, Thanks as always for sharing! What is your ultimate goal with regards to your business? Are you trying to get rich, become the worlds best breeders or something else? If you can define that, the rest is fairly mechanical and you'll be able to attain your goal buy developing a good business plan. There is plenty of money available to people who are passionate and directed and you'll find good people who'll work with and for you. The trick is knowing where you want to go. Let us know if there is anything we can do to help.
:hug:
:hug:
mephisto
AFN Authorized Vendor
Hi man, very good questions!.. quite complex answers but i'll try.
it's certainly time we got together and formulated something on paper, we usually have a plan in place for each 3 months ahead for example, and then a more general.. what do we need/want to have at this time next year, be it a special contact or something to do with the brand or bigger things like a new location or an employee, and so far we've done well in achieving those things.
Do we want to get rich?.. In a word, No. we live very modestly, we have an old beater car that's our little workhorse, we keep a well stocked fridge (food and seeds!) and as long as we can afford to do the things we want to do we're happy. I like the simple things, nice weather, nice food, nice ladies (earnt not bought!).
but, do we want to have to be worrying about bills, or sweating financially over minor things anymore, no.
but some things to bare in mind are.. risk, we take all precautions to marginalise this, but it's there.
longevity - this industry is constantly changing, in my mind there could well be a finite time we can be in the market.
Costs - As we expand there are inevitably more costs, and just the general running costs of the business already are expensive,
However we are in our prime working years, and neither of us are afraid of graft.
saying that, one thing we do need is a break, at some point.. i've probably moaned a little bit in the past that 4 days off is the longest single break we've had in 2.5 years+, so I would like to travel some, that's why i'd like to get on board with more shows and combine that work with travel. There's fairs in a lot of interesting countries now and it'd be amazing to do it.
For me, my main dedication and pleasure comes from the projects and the creation and advancement of autos, I see auto's as a cause, and I love them because they changed our lives.. sounds dramatic but it's true, and the other pleasure is watching you guys grow them out so nicely. I also like to know we have happy customers and the more we can satisfy the better.
I'm also starting to think if we mass produced our gear, it would lose something..., The current methods I don't think would scale up so easily, and involving third parties to do certain things on our behalf, I'm not that comfortable with.
But time will tell for all things, so the adventure is really still going, and to be continued..
As always, input is much appreciated
jackmc
Killing them softley
I would look to a California Vineyard, Mico Brewery/Distillery model. Connoisseur Automatics is exactly that. But what I'd do is first project the amount of money it will take to live how you'd like to live. You can fold your travel into that budget and anything else within reason into that number. Then do a break even analysis to understand what it takes a day to fund that life style. Then you can make all sorts of decisions, although that's just the beginning. But have an exit plan you'll do yourself and your business a favor by leaving the direct management of it at some time. It's hard to understand at the beginning of a venture how boring it becomes if it don't grow. The US market is going to be phenomenal for you once it becomes legal nationwide. I can't predict when that will happen but you should be able to have a very comfortable existence. I'd find someone to hire or partner with who has experience in a bigger company that is successful in your industry. Oops I gotta go I was supposed to meet my wife 1/2 hour ago. I shouldn't smoke pot and look at my computer. Anyway I'm rooting for you you seem to be a solid business person. Let me know if you need any help. :hug:
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mephisto
AFN Authorized Vendor
i'm hoping that we can travel to the expo's and put them through the business as an expense. Also we may be able to co-op with other companies which would lower costs, and then there's the potential revenue from sales at said fairs, so if we were able to break even on them financially but be able to get our brand's reach further that's a win-win.
all your suggestions are very good, it's just sometimes, as we've learnt from this occupation.. Numbers are just numbers until you have something actual in your hand. But we have enough experience to make educated guesses
We did scribble all notes down of various options in brief, but it needs deeper analysis and yes we do need a real business plan since we are now a real business
