Flirting with crossing

[savoy]

Excuse me in advance for any missteps in terminology I'm pretty ignorant about breeding and it gets awfully confusing. I do appreciate the thread on recurrent selection, I understood that for the most part anyway.

I have questions and am looking for advice and guidance. Ill start with what I'm working with, my goals, and the problems I'm trying to solve.

I hesitate to call this a breeding project, more of a crossing hobby/curiosity.
I don't have room for more than 10 plants for selection and can grow out 3 each male and female. I'm not trying to reinvent any strains, just get what I'd like to see out of 2 strains and cross them to see what happens.

The strains I'm working with are purple mazar, and white Sirus. these are the problems I'd like to improve on.

I've grown a few generations of purple Mazars and have yet to see one get very purple, they yield about 1.5 oz but stay pretty small in stature. The best yields are from the bushy pheno. So the goal is bigger purple and bushy.

The white Sirus I've had bad luck with wierd plants but managed seeds with a male from femmed seeds. The mother of the seeds was small, the father had mutated leaves. So i don't have the best starting point but I hope if I grow it out enough I can shed those traits and get tall bushy plants like they're supposed to be.

Once I get what I'm looking for from those I want to combine them to get a tall bushy purple and or white cross. I've already crossed a nice pm with the ws pollen I collected and they're starting out fine at a week old but that was for kicks no traits or plan.

I just began germing 10 of my White Sirus seeds and the advice I'm looking for is what signs I should look for early on about selection. Also should I pollinate all the females and keep the seeds from the best end performer? Since males only live a month or so do I just collect from the best one at the time of pollen dropping? Or do I grow them full term and keep the pollen from the best one for pollination next round?

If it matters I'm growing in soil, led veg, hps flower. I have a small cfl cabinet for the males.

If anyone wants to give me some pointers or link a good thread I'd appreciate it.

Cheers!

 

[savoy]

One last thought. Would it serve me best to just grow normally but be ready to pollinate when a particlary special plant pops up?
I just realized that this is all inbreeding, so is that even a good idea?

 

[savoy]

Whoa man! I've been lurking other boards for answers and the more it starts to make sense the more complex it gets. I'm going to do a bunch of research and start posting my findings here for debate. I think I should focus on getting the best out of the two strains I have for a couple grows to get the hang of selection then I'll cross them. I've read some interesting stuff on male selection, seems like the dudes get overlooked in this game, we all know what we want out of the females, haha.

 

[Georgia]

I've read some interesting stuff on male selection, seems like the dudes get overlooked in this game, we all know what we want out of the females, haha.

From reading, and experience males are the more important factor to develop stability to an f-1.. However you;re looking at inbreeding, so I wonder why you don;t just find your favourite, and overflower to induce a self-pollination.. upsides are feminisation, downsides are inbreeding.. that's pretty simplistic viewpoint I think, but it's where my thinking starts..

Lowryder (which is the bulk of our autoflower world) carries the auto gene in the males (from my understanding).. so you want to breed with auto males to photo fems.. then inbreed for stability, or continue to mutate the gene with additional auto males..
wher the overall thinking goes (as it needs to) is genetics.. as a cannabis culture, we are sadly unaware of pheno control and rna mapping.. let alone ruderalis specifics.. hell, the strength of sativa into an indica is narrow knowledge..

Here's an argument for the creation of hobby hybrids (though not really a persuasive one)
BUT dogs, for example (not quite apples to apples), make fantastic hybrid creatures and eventually can be returned to stable variuants of one of their original breeds with size (especially size) modified) with little to no loss in the color and temperament traits of the desired breed..

like we can take an australian shepherd, breed it with a german shepherd female and then bring the german size traits back to the aussie by generationally breeding the female offspring with male aussies for three generations. at the end you have an aussie with a larger size female.
I'd like to think this applies to the cannabis world as well..

any thoughts??

 

[savoy]

Whew, I'll need to digest that one for a bit. Sounds interesting, though photos aren't an option. I just upgraded to a pretty scientific grow rig, so I'm have room to f... around, while maintaining one steady strain.

 

[savoy]

Okay so I think I get the gist. This genetics stuff is all very logical, but I am a conceptual person so I made a chart so I can visualize what I'm thinking. Where I get confused is when you make the hybrid cross do you grow out two separate lines, inbreed whichever side you like best, or pick a male or female from each side like in my chart?

I should add that I'm crossing white sirus and purple mazar thats what the pm and ws are

 

[savoy]

I feel liked just keep talking to myself here but, it'll help me as I try to sort out a plan. I should describe the process thus far.

I started with purple Mazars that I made a bunch of seeds with, I've been growing those seeds and understand pm results, I have 10 left. I made seeds with 2 white Sirus that werent great of which I'm germing 10 of those now. I've not inbread the pm's yet, I will next round when I select out my remaining 10, the same with the next generation of ws. Ill select the best form both crops. That will give me inbread purple mazar, and inbread white Sirus from parents that i thought would be best as a stating point.

My space can only support a generation of 4 adult plants for breeding and still have enough room to grow something steady to keep my supply up. So that means I can weed out from 20 babies (10 each) no problem but when they sex and go into full pots I can keep 2 each. The male chamber can fit a lot as long as they're not in full pots.

This is where I get confused. I'll have 2 white Sirus girls and 2 purple mazar girls to seed with opposing pollen. How do I decide which of the hybrid seeds strains to grow out for the successive inbread f generations? And at the end do I pollinate with a male p1, and which do I choose?